The Retro-PES Corner

geeeeee said:
My brother and me played some excellent games in our LEWS CUP 2017-? on PES2008 PS2
Here were the results...i am ‘g’ he is ‘a’, amount of shots in brackets.

http://www.mediafire.com/view/35xiuwo63umm6iw/2018-10-26 05.16.31.000.jpg

Hopefully the link works :P

What is so great is that we are both locked together in wins. After 97 games i have won 49 and he has won 48.
Click to expand...

Sorry to quote myself but I am meeting my brother today to play another 6 games in our LEWS CUP 2017-? Competition.

Fixtures are...

QPR v Real Betis
Vallencia v Trinidad & Tobago
Wales v Atalanta
L. Moscow v Man City
Brazil v Brighton
AC Milan v West Ham

Not sure who will be taking control of each team yet until we roll the dice. Head to head it is me 49 my brother 48. Will post the results when I get the chance.
 
Jesus Christ, i can't be the only one here being annoyed and stressed out by the cheating of the AI/CPU - it's not in every match, but when it's there it is pointless to play... it hurts badly... i so wanted to love these games... I've been playing daily, shit i even read thru the freaking guide book. It's a damn shame... Maybe for multiplayer it's good, but for single player experience it's the devil :MAD: ...

And the cheating by the AI is well documented and continues 'till this day in newer releases, same goes usualy for the FIFA games... BUT i played a lot of old retro football the last months, from PC to exclusive ones on consoles to find a good one. And i found one that, in terms of playability, graphic & most of all, a fair AI is untouchable! It's straight fire from the moment the game starts to the final whistle. And when you loose, you feel not cheated - you simply wasn't good enough that day. A real breeze. Exactly what i was looking for. A solid enjoyable retro football game!

... to be revealed soon :TU::RSCARF:
 
Hoshii said:
Jesus Christ, i can't be the only one here being annoyed and stressed out by the cheating of the AI/CPU - it's not in every match, but when it's there it is pointless to play... it hurts badly... i so wanted to love these games... I've been playing daily, shit i even read thru the freaking guide book. It's a damn shame... Maybe for multiplayer it's good, but for single player experience it's the devil :MAD: ...

And the cheating by the AI is well documented and continues 'till this day in newer releases, same goes usualy for the FIFA games... BUT i played a lot of old retro football the last months, from PC to exclusive ones on consoles to find a good one. And i found one that, in terms of playability, graphic & most of all, a fair AI is untouchable! It's straight fire from the moment the game starts to the final whistle. And when you loose, you feel not cheated - you simply wasn't good enough that day. A real breeze. Exactly what i was looking for. A solid enjoyable retro football game!

... to be revealed soon :TU::RSCARF:
Click to expand...
I saw your post im the other topic. I disagree as i find pes 5 the most innocent pes in terms of AI cheating/handicap/scripting.
 
MafiaMurderBag said:
How you been getting on with the shooting? I've been playing this all week as i'm doing a WC 2002 series and the shots are ballooning into the stands almost every time. It's really context sensitive but i feel like the rising shots is a little excessive.

@MadbaLL I've been getting pretty hammered on Top Player on PES6, some nice variety by the AI on this game. Only problem is when you watch CPU vs CPU matches on this, not matter the difficulty or match length, the AI just seems dumb as heck. Enter a competition though and they tear you a new one.
Click to expand...
I have 26 yr old Matic on top right wing with 97 shot power and 20 year old Riberio with 85 shot power on the left side. I have manually assigned them to make runs (the arrows on individual) to the dbox. I have regen Minanda in the mid spreading the balls out wide to these attacks. Matic had one ridiculous outside of the foot volley (rare shot) just inches over the bar which looked amazing in the replay.

The good thing about having these 200cm giants is that they are so dominant in the air, and its easy to bring the ball down with them all while mauling the defenders marking you...let it bounce and hit them at the goal :3 . I play long balls most often so i oftentimes end up with a lot of bounces and volley shots, adds to the variety. They constitute to about 10% goals in every 10 games i play. You do tend to sky the ball more often than not, and that is the fun part of it, you have to be so precise with the volleys. I avoid taking shots on balls that have just bounced infront of me, but i reckon you know the basics, ofcourse so not going too much into details, I either let it drop down or at least hit it when its on its peak point, but the AI pressures are so precise they force you to an error. Also, this manual formation has redefined the way the game plays. The game (pes 6) is dynamic as it is, but i keep finding new ways to score with custom formations.

I have Red dead 2 in my ps4, some other games that i have yet to finish and still, i switch to my pc and load up pes 6 and end up playing it all night, regardless. I have played this game for 12 years and it still find new things and new ways to score.
 
Hoshii said:
@slamsoze ... that's really interesting, to say the least :BLINK:

Then from your point of view, which one is the most guilty out of the old PES's?
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Just to make things clear by CPU cheating I mean that as soon as I learned the game , it does not follow my commands input and does random things so the AI can score to add illusion of challenge.
With this as a base I would say the era pes 2008-2010 and 2011-2013.These were the games where Teamvision and adaptive AI were introduced in the series and none of these games could be played by me on hardest difficulty level no matter my skill curve.
More specifically I could say pes 2009 and 2013 makes me feel blatantly cheated and unable to control the flow of a match.
 
@slamsoze From the games you've mentioned i only played 09 & 10. And yes, they cheat as well. What i consider cheating AI is best displayed in the following videos. The first game is a fair match, the second one is the CPU trolling you with precise movement & control. Both games are on the same ML with 3 Star Level.

Normal game:
Click to expand...

Cheating AI:
**** especially at 7:15 ****

Click to expand...

I'm not even mentioned the other 'shady' things, as the example above breaks the game single handedly for me.
 
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@MafiaMurderBag
Not that bad? I have to disagree. Even if you're angry, you can't slide-tackle the AI with full-on bad intentions because it reacts like a uber-machine to every move you make and bypasses you with the quickness!

If it's not bad, it's at least NO fun.. If they kept this kind of "hardness" for the upper levels 4/5/6 stars that would be great. It ruins the game and feels unnecessary.

But it's also the other way around - when you suddenly win against top-team with 3-0 in liga mode. I really feel like some matches are not decided by skill, it's more like 70% scripted vs. 30% skill.
 
geeeeee said:
Sorry to quote myself but I am meeting my brother today to play another 6 games in our LEWS CUP 2017-? Competition.

Fixtures are...

QPR v Real Betis
Vallencia v Trinidad & Tobago
Wales v Atalanta
L. Moscow v Man City
Brazil v Brighton
AC Milan v West Ham

Not sure who will be taking control of each team yet until we roll the dice. Head to head it is me 49 my brother 48. Will post the results when I get the chance.
Click to expand...

So we actually played 8 games yesterday and what another fantastic gaming session we had!

The two extra games were...

Borussia Monchengladbach v Spain (check out the scoring sequence, so gripping. Costa was rated 9, he had 9 shots that were all on target!)

Stoke v Sheff Wed ( @Placebo will be happy :) )

Scores are here...

http://www.mediafire.com/view/bblaculzfpvmlw7/97A400E2-1818-4A14-B514-EA422FCFDF61.jpeg

‘g’ is me and ‘a’ is my brother. Shots in brackets.

It was 49 wins to me and 48 to my brother. After this session it is 53 me 52 to my bro. It is so tight. So far he cannot get in front of me even after drawing level.

Next fixtures are...

Galatasaray v B. Dortmund
Schalke v Argentina
Torino v Turkey
Cameroon v Besiktas
Lazio v Peru
Udinese v Huddersfield
Birmingham v Switzerland
Italy v Burnley
Bristol City v Cardiff
Mexico v Slovenia
Juventus v Belgium

These will be played hopefully by the end of the year. Some teams have had a ‘bye’ to the next round which enables us to have 64 teams left. I may do some videos next time as I would really love to share and remember some of the fascinating games especially once my brother and me get arthritis in our thumbs and can no longer play anymore :P
 
mattmid said:
@geeeeee Great stuff :) Spurs old boy, Chris Hughton, masterminded a hell of a win there! :D
Click to expand...

Yeh you could see it was coming. Brazil doing all their fancy stuff dribbling passing etc... but Brighton were getting the better chances. The winner was a fantastic cross and header. And the Brighton scorer is Colombian so he would have loved that goal all the more.

Shame Spurs are already out, think they lost 5-1 to Leicester and I was Spurs and is one of my biggest defeats in the game.
 
PES5 probably used to frustrate me the most because of the amount of fouls topped with the CPU just not wanting me to score :LOL:
 
So I've been setting up my own version of the Nations League on PES3, playing as Portugal of course.
16 National Teams, including the best of the world and a few representing each region - which explains why weaker sides like Mexico and Australia made it in. 30 matches, home and away, to decide the ultimate winner.

I was always of the opinion that early 00's Portugal would be a perfect fit for a 3-5-2, one of my favourite formations, due to the fact that we had little defensive talent (besides an ageing Fernando Couto), no decent sidebacks besides Rui Jorge, and too much offensive talent to fit our regular 4-5-1 that the team used in real-life. I decided to set up our PES3 Nations League team with that formation, using a high defensive line and lots of pressure, and went with this starting eleven:

Ricardo; Ricardo Rocha, Fernando Couto, Paulo Bento; Deco, Rui Costa, Figo, Sérgio Conceição, Rui Jorge; Pauleta, Nuno Gomes.

GK: Ricardo is a better goalie than Moreira and Vítor Baía, the other two I called-up.
CBs: Couto plays as a Libero, sitting a little bit behind the other two. He's got a 91 defense stat, amazing header skills as well, but is super slow (69 speed/64 acceleration). Ricardo Rocha is less defensively-skiled as Couto, but is much faster and, overall, a very decent defender. As for Paulo Bento, he's a natural DMF I adapted to the role, typically he can't even play there (can't remember him playing as a CB in real-life either). Has much lower defense than Rocha, but has 90 stamina.
DMF: Deco. He's not a DMF, actually an AMF that could double as CMF if needed. I tried using him as a kind of Regista, the Pirlo of our team.
AMFs: Rui Costa plays a bit closer to Deco than Figo, the other AMF. These two need no introduction, classic 90s/00s superstars. Figo played as a RMF in real-life, here I put him as an AMF on the left-side, hoping he could score more from there.
SMFs: Rui Jorge, a natural LB, plays as a LMF. Sérgio Conceição is a natural SMF, has more offensive power than Rui Jorge who is much more balanced, but less skilled.
CFs: Pauleta and Nuno Gomes. The former is one of the best strikers of the game, +90s for Attack and Shot Acc.; while Nuno Gomes has more Shot Technique but is not as good otherwise - even if he's very solid nevertheless.

The season starts and after a few matches, we're in trouble. We struggle to reach the top spots of the table, and are closer to the bottom actually. Even theoretically easier matches are a drag for us. Something is not right, so I tweak our strategy.

-> Our defense is a nightmare. My bet on Paulo Bento as a CB was a spectacular failure, dragging down the other two often. I needed to drop Couto a little bit deeper, as his poor speed/agility was becoming a liability. So, I replaced Bento with Jorge Costa, another slow CB, though he's very strong and good on the air.
-> Deco as a DMF was not that bad of a choice, but given the level of quality is too high on this league, a natural DMF would fit better. DaCosta (Costinha in real life) replaced him, a defensive-minded DMF that helped balancing our strategy perfectly.
-> Pauleta and Nuno Gomes were often clashing with each other, both occupying the same areas up front. Given Rui Costa, Figo and those two were (and naturally are) keen on attacking central areas, we needed more width. When Pauleta got injured and had to miss 5/6 matches, natural-WG Simão took over and it was probably the best decision I took over the course of this save. Still, though I dropped him really close to the right wing, I had him registered as a CF for him to join Nuno Gomes often on the middle - though not as often as Pauleta did!

sRT0xpj.jpg

After these changes, we went on a 8W-2D-0-L streak that catapulted us to the top-5 of the table. With 4 matches to go until the end, England was 1st with just 3 more points than Italy, Portugal, Argentina and Brazil.
I looked at our schedule and was very confident.
We had to beat Australia, Spain, USA and Mexico if we wanted to put pressure on England and perhaps win it all. Spain would be the tougher side, but it's still not the Spain we know nowadays: besides Raúl, Casillas, and a few other interesting players such as a young Xavi and Joaquín, we were actually better than them, in theory at least. As for the other 3 teams, we were expecting to win each game easily.
vs Australia...1-1. Oh sh*t. Thankfully, all other title candidates drew their matches as well...
We win it vs. Spain, 1-3. Back on track.
vs USA...2-0 for us on the 70th minute. 71st, Nuno Gomes gets a red card after a career-ending sliding tackle. 72nd, 2-1. 78th...2-2. We draw the match, and it means we won't win the title because England won their match.
vs Mexico, could clinch the 3rd spot if we won and Italy drew/lost...we get a 1-1 draw.
yeHrZFy.jpg

England gets their first title since 1966, proving that a solid defense is a priority for title contenders. Senegal was a surprise, they actually were leaders of the league halfway through the season. Netherlands was disappointing, so was Germany with the likes of Ballack, Kahn, Klose...

nur395N.jpg
 
Great post @miguelfcp!
Makes me wanna play PES3 again.

Titch said:
PES5 probably used to frustrate me the most because of the amount of fouls topped with the CPU just not wanting me to score :LOL:
Click to expand...

This. I go back to replay it every so often but I can't because the CPU CANNOT SCORE.

I played the games for years and never noticed it. I don't know how lol.
 
@miguelfcp Sounds like it was a great league. I'm not that surprised with Senegal doing fairly well, they had some decent players around that time, quite a few played in the Premier League. Nice to see Portsmouth old boy, Ricardo Rocha :D, a firm fan favourite during his time with us.
 
miguelfcp said:
So I've been setting up my own version of the Nations League on PES3, playing as Portugal of course.
16 National Teams, including the best of the world and a few representing each region - which explains why weaker sides like Mexico and Australia made it in. 30 matches, home and away, to decide the ultimate winner.

I was always of the opinion that early 00's Portugal would be a perfect fit for a 3-5-2, one of my favourite formations, due to the fact that we had little defensive talent (besides an ageing Fernando Couto), no decent sidebacks besides Rui Jorge, and too much offensive talent to fit our regular 4-5-1 that the team used in real-life. I decided to set up our PES3 Nations League team with that formation, using a high defensive line and lots of pressure, and went with this starting eleven:

Ricardo; Ricardo Rocha, Fernando Couto, Paulo Bento; Deco, Rui Costa, Figo, Sérgio Conceição, Rui Jorge; Pauleta, Nuno Gomes.

GK: Ricardo is a better goalie than Moreira and Vítor Baía, the other two I called-up.
CBs: Couto plays as a Libero, sitting a little bit behind the other two. He's got a 91 defense stat, amazing header skills as well, but is super slow (69 speed/64 acceleration). Ricardo Rocha is less defensively-skiled as Couto, but is much faster and, overall, a very decent defender. As for Paulo Bento, he's a natural DMF I adapted to the role, typically he can't even play there (can't remember him playing as a CB in real-life either). Has much lower defense than Rocha, but has 90 stamina.
DMF: Deco. He's not a DMF, actually an AMF that could double as CMF if needed. I tried using him as a kind of Regista, the Pirlo of our team.
AMFs: Rui Costa plays a bit closer to Deco than Figo, the other AMF. These two need no introduction, classic 90s/00s superstars. Figo played as a RMF in real-life, here I put him as an AMF on the left-side, hoping he could score more from there.
SMFs: Rui Jorge, a natural LB, plays as a LMF. Sérgio Conceição is a natural SMF, has more offensive power than Rui Jorge who is much more balanced, but less skilled.
CFs: Pauleta and Nuno Gomes. The former is one of the best strikers of the game, +90s for Attack and Shot Acc.; while Nuno Gomes has more Shot Technique but is not as good otherwise - even if he's very solid nevertheless.

The season starts and after a few matches, we're in trouble. We struggle to reach the top spots of the table, and are closer to the bottom actually. Even theoretically easier matches are a drag for us. Something is not right, so I tweak our strategy.

-> Our defense is a nightmare. My bet on Paulo Bento as a CB was a spectacular failure, dragging down the other two often. I needed to drop Couto a little bit deeper, as his poor speed/agility was becoming a liability. So, I replaced Bento with Jorge Costa, another slow CB, though he's very strong and good on the air.
-> Deco as a DMF was not that bad of a choice, but given the level of quality is too high on this league, a natural DMF would fit better. DaCosta (Costinha in real life) replaced him, a defensive-minded DMF that helped balancing our strategy perfectly.
-> Pauleta and Nuno Gomes were often clashing with each other, both occupying the same areas up front. Given Rui Costa, Figo and those two were (and naturally are) keen on attacking central areas, we needed more width. When Pauleta got injured and had to miss 5/6 matches, natural-WG Simão took over and it was probably the best decision I took over the course of this save. Still, though I dropped him really close to the right wing, I had him registered as a CF for him to join Nuno Gomes often on the middle - though not as often as Pauleta did!

sRT0xpj.jpg

After these changes, we went on a 8W-2D-0-L streak that catapulted us to the top-5 of the table. With 4 matches to go until the end, England was 1st with just 3 more points than Italy, Portugal, Argentina and Brazil.
I looked at our schedule and was very confident.
We had to beat Australia, Spain, USA and Mexico if we wanted to put pressure on England and perhaps win it all. Spain would be the tougher side, but it's still not the Spain we know nowadays: besides Raúl, Casillas, and a few other interesting players such as a young Xavi and Joaquín, we were actually better than them, in theory at least. As for the other 3 teams, we were expecting to win each game easily.
vs Australia...1-1. Oh sh*t. Thankfully, all other title candidates drew their matches as well...
We win it vs. Spain, 1-3. Back on track.
vs USA...2-0 for us on the 70th minute. 71st, Nuno Gomes gets a red card after a career-ending sliding tackle. 72nd, 2-1. 78th...2-2. We draw the match, and it means we won't win the title because England won their match.
vs Mexico, could clinch the 3rd spot if we won and Italy drew/lost...we get a 1-1 draw.
yeHrZFy.jpg

England gets their first title since 1966, proving that a solid defense is a priority for title contenders. Senegal was a surprise, they actually were leaders of the league halfway through the season. Netherlands was disappointing, so was Germany with the likes of Ballack, Kahn, Klose...

nur395N.jpg
Click to expand...

@miguelfcp , to be honest, you could get away with any formation with the Portugal teams of the late 90's to early 2000's. What a midfield group: Figo, Rui Costa and Segio Conceicao. Footballing gods for the ages.

:WORSHIP::WORSHIP::WORSHIP:
 
@WhoAteMeDinner: Too bad that PES3 doesn't have an accurate Ricardo Carvalho, Jorge Andrade, or Maniche (and Deco's statsheet is quite questionable, but to a lesser degree), otherwise it would be a hell of a team. I'm starting one another league like this, this time on PES4, and here's the team:

Vítor Baía; Jorge Andrade, Ricardo Carvalho, Beto; Costinha, Maniche, Deco, Rui Costa; Figo, Cristiano Ronaldo, Pauleta.

Portuguese readers, please don't wet your pants.
 
miguelfcp said:
@WhoAteMeDinner: Too bad that PES3 doesn't have an accurate Ricardo Carvalho, Jorge Andrade, or Maniche (and Deco's statsheet is quite questionable, but to a lesser degree), otherwise it would be a hell of a team. I'm starting one another league like this, this time on PES4, and here's the team:

Vítor Baía; Jorge Andrade, Ricardo Carvalho, Beto; Costinha, Maniche, Deco, Rui Costa; Figo, Cristiano Ronaldo, Pauleta.

Portuguese readers, please don't wet your pants.
Click to expand...

In my ML years ago Andrade scored an own goal for my team. What was funny is that he also scored an own goal in the final of the competition that me and my brother were playing at the time. It was in the same week. It’s really sad because I always remember him for those two fictional moments rather than how good he was in real life :)
 
miguelfcp said:
@WhoAteMeDinner: Too bad that PES3 doesn't have an accurate Ricardo Carvalho, Jorge Andrade, or Maniche (and Deco's statsheet is quite questionable, but to a lesser degree), otherwise it would be a hell of a team. I'm starting one another league like this, this time on PES4, and here's the team:

Vítor Baía; Jorge Andrade, Ricardo Carvalho, Beto; Costinha, Maniche, Deco, Rui Costa; Figo, Cristiano Ronaldo, Pauleta.

Portuguese readers, please don't wet your pants.
Click to expand...
mattmid said:
Don't knock it, we're in the International version of the Checkatrade Semi Final now :D
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But there are no under-21 big team sides and the old boys are not even trying a leg. Scotland are top of their group for goodness sake.

:SHAKE::SHAKE::SHAKE:
 
:OT:
Was looking to offload a few unwanted PS 2 games, (non-PES games of course, from my cold dead hand you could not wrench any PES game from me, even PES 2010).

So went to a local gaming store (CEX, UK and IRL forumers will be familiar). And was almost reduced to laughter at the second hand prices offered: between 10 cents and 60 cents per game.

No wonder our little blue and green sphere is totally fuc'd, we actively encourage people to toss stuff like plastic into the sea when you are offered zilch in financial incentives to be responsible.

Any forum members from other countries get a better deal on selling old games ?
:SHOCK::SHOCK::SHOCK:
 
@WhoAteMeDinner: Sad to hear that your PS2 catalog is getting lighter...Dinner my friend, I hope you get a few more titles to compensate such loss!
We have CEX here in Portugal too, and I too found it appalling to see how much they offer for PS2 games. Can't complain much though, as I bought there a PES5 PS2 in perfect condition for just 50 cents...
Don't you have OLX over there? Usually you're able to get much better deals there, from a seller's point of view, particularly if you offer some kind of pack of multiple PS2 titles.
 
Red_Star_Belgrade said:
Nice one konami :DD (pes 2 ps1, goal scored by CPU)

Click to expand...

@Red_Star_Belgrade , gotta love the old Pro Evo games on on the playstation. Upright, teutonic dribbling and the regular incredibly unfair game glitches that make it all the more real football in character.

Ref takes a bung off the COM team is not as bad as UEFA taking a fat brown envelope from a big club to overlook a drug addict player.

:R1:R1:R1
 
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