PES 2020 Rumours Discussion Thread

[Flipper the Priest]

Although I work in social media professionally, I don't use it in a personal capacity as it's toxic; so I'm not sure who these guys are and what they do.

However, from what I do know, that model of collecting feedback is a bizarre one. As far as PR and engagement goes, being that open to suggestion suggests suggestibility. If the direction of the game and the brand hinges purely on commercial success then you're merely setting up for a fall. And to put two individuals out there as your lightning rods? Extra strange.

As far as PES goes all the feedback you want is at your fingertips without inviting it on to yourself.

 

[bullet]

What i am really wondering is, where do they get the feedback from now to build their next game? I suppose that it doesnt really matter anymore what football simulation fans think, and i expect the next PES will be a game for myclub players, who are not interested in how the game feels like as long as they can play with CR7 and Messi or Neymar , score goals easily and feel happy. I think FIFA and PES have reached a level where a third competitor should step in and they would be succesful if they deliver a football game for real football fans.

 

[Fakku]

I miss those times where if you're currently using CR7, u feel like using him, the goodness of his dribbling, etc, now every players feels the same

 

[Pwalie86]

Too much pay-to-win with footy games nowadays. I just want a football playing simulation game with a Football Manager kind of depth to it. Yet it's all been shafted for a card game where Messi is playing beside George Best in an England kit or something daft like that.

Not expecting much from either offline modes this year. Yet they still expect their offline fans to pay £50 or so for minor updates. It should be criminal.

 

[Chris Davies]

It'd be nice to have full kit selection/combination back.

Because it turns out, over in La Liga, match officials do just that pre-game.

So weird to see the screenshot and think, that's a real-life app, not a game...

 

[Marlon Anthony]

It'd be nice to have full kit selection/combination back.

Because it turns out, over in La Liga, match officials do just that pre-game.

So weird to see the screenshot and think, that's a real-life app, not a game...

It does look like the FIFA interface, wouldn't surprise me if the developers of that app were inspired by the game.

But i concur, i long for the day when such a simple feature will return. The more options for the visual experience the better. Even though we could change kit combinations on PES 5, we still had no input over what the goal keepers or the referee would wear, which is infuriating to say the least.

 

[Daytripper]

To me, Konami recruiting Adam & Asim as PR was just... Bizarre. I think that despite operating a fan blog and message board is challenging, I don't really understand how that makes you a suitable candidate to be a PR Rep/community manager for a leading brand. The way they conducted themselves in the role on Twitter in regards to snapping back, blocking people and being sensitive to the trolling etc just underlines that they weren't experienced and weren't equipped or qualified for that kind of position. Could you imagine Sony, Microsoft, Coke Cola or Apple having a Social Media account with as belligerent and childish retaliation as Adam & Asim's? You just can't conduct yourself like that in public or on social media, Even if you're correct or justified, As unfortunately, anybody with a low IQ can have a social media account, trolling is also inevitable... It's just a industry no no.

Konami are responsible for the entire social media circumstance, as the saying goes; don't hate the player, hate the game. Be mad at Konami for employing them in the role. I reckon if they asked any of us and offered us that kind of money and a chance to travel the world we'd probably take it. However i also think Asim underestimated the grind of the long hours and the toxic corporate nature of the company and probably explains why he left.

After all, we've established that Konami wasn't really interested in taking aboard feedback and heeding offline players concerns when they changed direction and wanted to focus on the cash cow of myClub. But this culture of being un-receptive to your community rep and abandoning him to face the trolls isn't something new and was exactly what Jon Murphy's role was, difference is that he had a lot more grace, experience and understood how to behave in that role.

I don't know what their purpose was as Konami have plugged their own news and updates, Data Packs and myClub features on their own twitter accounts anyway so i don't really know why they even recruited Adam & Asim other than to maybe be cheerleaders and assumed they were so highly respected in the community, that they'd give the PES brand credibility?

Not 100% sure on this but I think Adam worked at Ubisoft for a while in a role similar to PR.

Taking people’s points on board about Asim, it’s a good point we didn’t know his full duties/his role but maybe he should of considered that too, that we don’t know what goes on and with that understand we are the outside looking in so when he came under criticism he should remind himself of it. Easier said than done of course but perhaps something to have kept in mind.

Those WENB articles from “curdstar” were dodgy, the timing, the sniping tone of them which Asim promoted on his twitter. I still find it odd that WENB closed not long after, something not right there. Why close it ? If it was that irrelevant why use it in a way to tell parts of community to do one?

The “haters gonna hate” mentality is usually detrimental to a product in the long run. How is wanting better for a game a bad thing? Even the angry stuff, use it to your advantage for the good of the product/content by trying to sort those things out people are most of critical of. Easier said than done but at least it shows some humility, responsibility, genuine passion, not jobs for the boys crap.

 

[Chuny]

You can't expect a company to behave seriously when they aren't serious about the people they hire to work for them.
It's as simple as that.

There are many of the Evo-Web members that fit the profile for those roles that Adam and Asim are/were occupying A LOT better than them. By a mile.
Yet I would still find it awkward if Konami just hired them out of the blue, without doing a proper study, interviews, tests, etc to see if that's what PES needs.

 

[loco]

It really annoys me how much the franchise has regressed. Even a game like Fifa 12 is miles ahead in gameplay (with slight slider tweaks) and presentation than PES 2019. Unbelievable.

 

[Chris Davies]

It really annoys me how much the franchise has regressed. Even a game like Fifa 12 is miles ahead in gameplay (with slight slider tweaks) and presentation than PES 2019. Unbelievable.

This is A) a million miles off-topic and B) deliberately inflammatory, let's not go down this path guys.

 

[loco]

This is A) a million miles off-topic and B) deliberately inflammatory, let's not go down this path guys.

My intention was not to flame (there are more flaming posts in this topic if that is the case with this one), but rather to point out the regression of the game. And don't agree about the miles off-topic, it could be somewhat off-topic, but I was piggybacking on chuny's post. It's one of the consequences (older games being better in many aspects, PES or Fifa) of the many bad decisions Konami has made (including what chuny and others have mentioned).

But agree that it could be interpreted as a flaming or too controversial point of view, so I won't go back down that path.

 

[normazimuth]

The last few pages of this thread, which seems to be little more than a discussion about Asim and Adam, is completely off topic. I didn't notice any news whatsoever about PES2020.

 

[Schwarzenbeck]

With all the gloomy predictions and foregone negativity here, I still reckon that most of us (myself included) will buy it day one and think for at least the first three weeks that it‘s the „best evah“. And it‘d only be natural.

 

[Ameppe]

With all the gloomy predictions and foregone negativity here, I still reckon that most of us (myself included) will buy it day one and think for at least the first three weeks that it‘s the „best evah“. And it‘d only be natural.

This year, like last year, i have no intention to buy it at day one. Last year the huge amount of negativity coming from this forum about offline modes few days after release confirmed i was not going to buy it, not even when it was sold at 10€ on Ps store.

This year i will do the same. I have faith that if there will be big improvements to offline modes and Master League opinions here will reflect that and i will decide to buy it later during a sale.

Unfortunately i don't think a Pes is the best ever, even if just for few days, since Pes 2017. Pes 2018 and 2019 have been a disaster for me.

 

[loco]

With all the gloomy predictions and foregone negativity here, I still reckon that most of us (myself included) will buy it day one and think for at least the first three weeks that it‘s the „best evah“. And it‘d only be natural.

Not sure if it's going to be a day one buy, but I think in my case I will always give the franchise a chance to redeem itself and at least try their latest release (not the demo, because usually demo gameplay is better than final retail gameplay).

 

[normazimuth]

After the horrible PES2019, it will be easy for me to not buy it on day 1. This has been the first year that I've gone back to a previous version, which I much prefer to the latest version, so that has definitely changed my mentality - no longer is it a case of the newest must be the best.

I'll still be very keen to try out the demo but only if it really shines will I buy it at full price. I'm perfectly prepared to wait for it to drop to under £20, or if it's clearly another dud like 19, not buy it at all.

 

[Chuny]

With all the gloomy predictions and foregone negativity here, I still reckon that most of us (myself included) will buy it day one and think for at least the first three weeks that it‘s the „best evah“. And it‘d only be natural.

I will too.
But that's just part of how obsessed I am with football as a whole. I will buy both games and therefore be entintled to criticise them properly (I really hope I won't have to though!).

Not going to lie, I have a little ray of hope inside of me that thinks that they will deliver an all-around good game this year. With very good creative new menus/interface, ironing out the issues with PES 2019, and with some new additional content like a better ML and probably some new game mode.

 

[gabe.paul.logan]

The last few pages of this thread, which seems to be little more than a discussion about Asim and Adam, is completely off topic. I didn't notice any news whatsoever about PES2020.

I think we can make it to 20 without any news!

 

[Schwarzenbeck]

Not going to lie, I have a little ray of hope inside of me that thinks that they will deliver an all-around good game this year. With very good creative new menus/interface, ironing out the issues with PES 2019, and with some new additional content like a better ML and probably some new game mode.

Hope you are right. A more likely scenario, however, could be that by January 2020 people will declare "I am done with this sh*t, I am going back to 2019". To be honest I think 19 isn't so bad. Yes, there is rage potential, but which version of PES didn't provide this? With a bit of patching and modding it's actually quite good. Not to say, that I don't expect more, tho.

 

[Emroth]

With a bit of patching and modding it's actually quite good.

For console players bit of patching and modding is not an option.
Yes, you are right that every Pes version had its flaws. However, no Pes ever delivered such diabolical AI.
Getting it day 1 was the case for me most of the time. This time im not even looking forward to Pes20 announcements tbh.
Its more of a curiosity to see how is the "legendary" 3 year plan going.
Even if they bring some changes to ML, do you really think they will spend a lot of time on AI? Dribbling, shooting, stats, team ID?
After what they did to AI in Pes19 they would have to focus all resources into trying to fix this mess. And we all know myClub will be priority.

 

[normazimuth]

Even if they bring some changes to ML, do you really think they will spend a lot of time on AI? Dribbling, shooting, stats, team ID?
After what they did to AI in Pes19 they would have to focus all resources into trying to fix this mess. And we all know myClub will be priority.

Yeah, the AI is the killer. If the matches play out like in 19, with its atrocious AI, total ignorance of stats, virtually no player or team individuality, then they could announce that they've brought in the entire Football Manager game and tacked it on as their new ML and it wouldn't be worth playing.

For me, 2020 is all about the AI. If it's not clearly been improved upon 2019's laughable crap, I really do fear that PES will be as good as dead as a 1-player offline game.

 

[piccolo_bsc]

For console players bit of patching and modding is not an option.
Yes, you are right that every Pes version had its flaws. However, no Pes ever delivered such diabolical AI.
Getting it day 1 was the case for me most of the time. This time im not even looking forward to Pes20 announcements tbh.
Its more of a curiosity to see how is the "legendary" 3 year plan going.
Even if they bring some changes to ML, do you really think they will spend a lot of time on AI? Dribbling, shooting, stats, team ID?
After what they did to AI in Pes19 they would have to focus all resources into trying to fix this mess. And we all know myClub will be priority.

I switched from PS4 to PC just because of the modding and the dt18-gameplay-improvement and i will also play PES 20 on PC. Even on Day 1 you can buy it for 30 bucks, which also saves money.
I agree with you about MyClub, sadly KONAMI will prioritize it because they have to to make money to stay competitive.

 

[Peter Withe]

To me, Konami recruiting Adam & Asim as PR was just... Bizarre. I think that despite operating a fan blog and message board is challenging, I don't really understand how that makes you a suitable candidate to be a PR Rep/community manager for a leading brand. The way they conducted themselves in the role on Twitter in regards to snapping back, blocking people and being sensitive to the trolling etc just underlines that they weren't experienced and weren't equipped or qualified for that kind of position. Could you imagine Sony, Microsoft, Coke Cola or Apple having a Social Media account with as belligerent and childish retaliation as Adam & Asim's? You just can't conduct yourself like that in public or on social media, Even if you're correct or justified, As unfortunately, anybody with a low IQ can have a social media account, trolling is also inevitable... It's just a industry no no.

Konami are responsible for the entire social media circumstance, as the saying goes; don't hate the player, hate the game. Be mad at Konami for employing them in the role. I reckon if they asked any of us and offered us that kind of money and a chance to travel the world we'd probably take it. However i also think Asim underestimated the grind of the long hours and the toxic corporate nature of the company and probably explains why he left.

After all, we've established that Konami wasn't really interested in taking aboard feedback and heeding offline players concerns when they changed direction and wanted to focus on the cash cow of myClub. But this culture of being un-receptive to your community rep and abandoning him to face the trolls isn't something new and was exactly what Jon Murphy's role was, difference is that he had a lot more grace, experience and understood how to behave in that role.

I don't know what their purpose was as Konami have plugged their own news and updates, Data Packs and myClub features on their own twitter accounts anyway so i don't really know why they even recruited Adam & Asim other than to maybe be cheerleaders and assumed they were so highly respected in the community, that they'd give the PES brand credibility?

Best post I’ve ever read on here.

 

[Ameobinho]

These are some issues that need to be forwarded to any Konami guy or anyone testing the game.
Also they need to come clear on what are they changing in their patches, Their fanboys claim there are no gameplay changes then their you tube puppets praise the patches for improving the game!

Some of the stuff of course Konami lied about and the others they just ignored :

Catchup bug/mechanism
AI low crossing spam
gk glued to their lines (they tried to fix it by reducing line height)
Defenses retreating to the six yard box
Back heels and tiki taka from every team (toned down then returned in the latest patches)
Top corner shots from the AI is the only type we see
Non existing fouls
Unable to win penalties vs AI
All teams play identical and no individuality what so ever
Lack of dribbling in the game from AI
Over powered keepers from long range
Player switching and general player awareness of the ball (specially second balls)
Passes going astray in a different direction despite different input by the user
Player running away from the ball
Players not clearing the ball allowing the AI to score
Clipping when the script kicks in
Replay camera still limited in height

I have zero hope but I think we owe it to the community to fight for this game to be fixed.

 

[Schwarzenbeck]

These are some issues that need to be forwarded to any Konami guy or anyone testing the game.
Also they need to come clear on what are they changing in their patches, Their fanboys claim there are no gameplay changes then their you tube puppets praise the patches for improving the game!

Some of the stuff of course Konami lied about and the others they just ignored :

Catchup bug/mechanism
AI low crossing spam
gk glued to their lines (they tried to fix it by reducing line height)
Defenses retreating to the six yard box
Back heels and tiki taka from every team (toned down then returned in the latest patches)
Top corner shots from the AI is the only type we see
Non existing fouls
Unable to win penalties vs AI
All teams play identical and no individuality what so ever
Lack of dribbling in the game from AI
Over powered keepers from long range
Player switching and general player awareness of the ball (specially second balls)
Passes going astray in a different direction despite different input by the user
Player running away from the ball
Players not clearing the ball allowing the AI to score
Clipping when the script kicks in
Replay camera still limited in height

I have zero hope but I think we owe it to the community to fight for this game to be fixed.

This is a great list and should be glued to the forehead of whoever is in charge of the development of this game.

However, half of the items on that list are things that have been mentioned for years. Some of them (catch-up, player switching issues) have actually been around since the early days. So what are the chances they gonna fix this, particularly when we consider that offline could be a dying branch?

At this stage I can only hope they fiddle around with the code and do something right by accident. Because when they have a vision, they usually f*ck things up.

 

[Lons]

KONAMI should create game without listen community from Adam and Asim. Its not problem to see forum like Evo-Web and look how fanbase thinking about game and what expect. They should have their own vision of football game like Pes 5/6 + look alone to the good Pes forum and implement some good stuff. That’s all. Their vision of football + some good stuff from rest of the world community = good game as well. I dont see any problem to make it.

 

[Stan]

Good article with John Murphy is available here.

Late reaction. Started reading until he talks about the reason Seabass was removed from the development team. He is talking about narrative versus sandbox games. Am i stupid thinking this is bullshit?

How can a football game be narrative or sandbox.

Is ML a narrative style and MYClunb sandbox?

Don't think so.

This intrigues me.

 

[PESBUL]

@Lons They do not listen anyone.. who from the community wants scripting and manipulative gameplay base on are you buy PES coins or not? I don't know anyone to want PES to by greedy and manipulative "pay-to-win" game but that what we have now. I expect PES 2020 to be even more greedy and manipulative.

 

[Matt10]

KONAMI should create game without listen community from Adam and Asim. Its not problem to see forum like Evo-Web and look how fanbase thinking about game and what expect. They should have their own vision of football game like Pes 5/6 + look alone to the good Pes forum and implement some good stuff. That’s all. Their vision of football + some good stuff from rest of the world community = good game as well. I dont see any problem to make it.

I'm still all for them sitting in a dark room, shutting off from the social media world, and truly digging in to create the game. Feedback is based on interpretation, and no matter what, there will be conflict. Even though we think there should be absolutes, this is a gaming generation that requires a sacrifice no matter where you stand.

 

[Chuny]

I'm still all for them sitting in a dark room, shutting off from the social media world, and truly digging in to create the game. Feedback is based on interpretation, and no matter what, there will be conflict. Even though we think there should be absolutes, this is a gaming generation that requires a sacrifice no matter where you stand.

I'm in!

In fact, guys... take a little longer. No rush. No need to release the game in August, September, October...
Just take 6 months longer than usual. Hell, take a whole extra year!