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Eredivisie Thread

Discussion in 'Football' started by robin_007, 30 July 2006.

  1. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax

    You can discuss everything about the Dutch Eredivisie here.
    Personally I think Ajax and PSV will go for the championship. Ajax has bought good players (Gabri, Roger Garcia, Ogararu, Perez, and of course Stam 8) ). Plus they allready had some good players and there are some new talents (Huntelaar, Rosenberg, Vermaelen, Emanuelson, Babel, Maduro and new youngster Jan Vertonghen).
    PSV hasn't lost a single player besides Theo Lucius who went to Feyenoord and Gerald Sibon who went to Nurnberg. They have in my opinion one of the best centre backs is the world (Alex), a great captain in Cocu, dangerous forwards like Farfan and Koné and good talents (Aissati and Affelay). They have bought good players like Manuel da Costa of Nacy and Salcido, the Mexican international.
    I don't really know about Feyenoord. They haven't lost Kuyt, but theire new signings aren't the greatest. Huysegems, Kolkka and Lucius can't convince me. They have bought a fantastic goalie in Henk Timmer, but it wasn't neccesary, because they allready had Lodewijks, who still is great. They've got some nice talents as Benjamin de Ceulaer, and 1 wonderchild: Jonathan de Guzman. Keep your eyes on him, he's going to make it.
    AZ is a dangerous outsider. They have lost some important players (Landzaat, Perez, Timmer and van Galen) but have bought some fantastic talents. Julian Jenner, David Mendes da Silva, Moussa Dembele and Gijs Luirink all have a fantastic future ahead from them. Plus they have bought some players who allready proven themself from being fantastisc players. I mean Simon Cziommer, Joey Didulica and Joey Gudjonsson.

    I think this season will be more thrilling than ever, not only for the championship, but also for the play-offs places. Teams like Groningen, Heerenveen, Twente and Roda will fight for this. Plus, who will relegate? Excelsior, ADO Den Haag, Heracles Almelo, Sparta and Feyenoord (:p) have the biggest chances.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 29 January 2012
  2. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    Not much interest in Dutch football, I think. :(
     
  3. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    There must be some Spanish guys around here, or at least some people who follow La Liga very good. So can someone tell me about new Ajax signing Roger Garcia? He played the last 12 years for Barca, Espanyol and Villareal.
     
  4. Big Boss

    Big Boss KJH = The Hunter!

    23 July 2003
    The Netherlands
    Ajax & Strasbourg
    Well lets hope we can finally challenge for the title again this season, the team definately looks stronger than the last couple of years.
    PSV did lose perhaps their most important person btw, in Guus Hiddink, hes one of the best managers in the world, Ronald Koeman didnt do very well with Ajax before, especially his signings were awfull, but he was lucky he had the likes of Zlatan, maxwell, Trabelsi and Galasek thanx to Adriaanse and Beenhakker, so he did atleast win the title. But he acxtually brought us down with his bad management, lets see how he does with PSV ;)

    dont know much about Roger, but i read somewhere Tan Cate found him slow? but dont know if thats true...
     
  5. Dominic

    Dominic Serie A Staff

    19 August 2003
    Netherlands
    Lelystad ey? Whoa you live around the corner Robin. I live in Almere myself.
     
  6. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    Almere is a nice city, but I hate to travel through it by train. How many stations do you need? :p
     
  7. Dominic

    Dominic Serie A Staff

    19 August 2003
    Netherlands
    Well the 4 stations come quite in handy actually.
     
  8. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    I beg to differ Robin but I think to be honest you're letting you bias get in the way of judging and comparing Ajax's summer signings vs. Feyenoord's

    Let me give a few example of why I think that is.
    Those 3 players aren't very convincing, you're right. But these 3 signings of Feyenoord don't convince you but Ajax's mediocre signings (Gabri and Roger) do? :-s :eh:

    Gabri vs. Lucius

    Gabri is a versatile but pretty mediocre player overall (Barca only had few mediocre players left and now they're getting rid of them slowly slowly...) and is injury prone as well.

    What's good about him is he works hard but that's no different from Theo Lucius!

    In fact while neither are impressive, If I had a choice I'd take Theo!

    He's more energetic than Gabri with a higher stamina and better fitness/condition and he too is a versatile and decent player.

    Difference is he's also been playing in Eredivisie all his life and knows everything about the league now and is fully settled while Gabri is coming to new territory!

    So that's that.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Perez vs. Huysegems

    Then we have two attacking AZ players ending up as rivals next year at Ajax and Feyenoord and they are Kenneth Perez and Stein Huysegems.

    The signing of Kenneth Perez does not impress me. He was a couple years ago (in his peak) a very good player. One of the best even in Eredivisie arguably and if Ajax had signed him then I would've been happy.

    But they've signed him now when in a month's time or so I think he'll turn 32!

    He's past his peak and has lost a LOT of pace/agility and shaprness over past year or so!

    Then we have a guy who always had a LOT of potential but still hasn't fulfilled it and that's the Belgian, Huysegems who still has a lot of time to do that as he's 24.

    Tall, fast, good left-foot, can take a great FK, sure he's inconcistent but if he gets regular playing time at Feyenoord, he could turn out to be a very good player.

    So AGAIN, I prefer Feyenoord signing, Huysegems over Kenneth Perez in this time and day!

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Then we have Kolkka vs. Roger (to compare their 3rd signing) even though both are different positions, Kolkka is a winger and Roger is an AMC, we'll talk about them anyway.

    Roger is a player who is less than impressive and not good enough for first team of most clubs in top leagues!

    He is good technically and has a good shot on his left-foot but.....

    1) He's a few years past his peak and has been showing signs of that whenever he's gotten a chance to play for Villarreal (often as a sub!) So he too is past his best and Ajax have acquired in the 'twilight years of his career' :| (and in fact I think both him and Perez are likely to be offloaded in a year or max two years from Ajax as they won't be good enough by then!)

    2) He is not EVEN a 90-min player anymore! He lacks stamina and fitness and can take small knocks and injuries often.

    3) He lack the proper determination/teamwork and fitness levels to be a 1st team regular! That's why he found himself on the bench at Villarreal and unless Ajax is desprate or very short on cover, same might happen here.

    4) He's SLOW!!

    Now.. Kolkka is no world-beater, that's for sure. The Finnish winger is also past his best and although not as fast as he once was (like Panathinaikos days for example), he still has enough pace and acceleration to trouble many defenders and put in good crosses or shots with either of his foot! (something Roger can't do! :nono:)

    So as for Roger whom you wanted to know more about,
    He's overall a player who still has it technically but for many other reasons is a MEDIOCRE player more or less and another signing that doesn't excite me at all and in fact saddens me. :(

    Because once upon a time, Ajax was one of the best in Europe and only GREAT players could play for this club. Now the quality of their signings clearly show that the club lacks proper ambition/fund/money and even if you're decent or avg, you can still be bought and play for this club. :|

    Well there's lot more talk about.. regarding other teams like AZ and their fab signings! 8) and much more stuff like the champions PSV but this is already getting quite long and I'll leave it at this.
     
  9. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    Yes, it's true, I'm very biased. The rivalry is too deep for me to judge correctly, but I try.

    Lucius is a good player, a very good player. But I think Gabri is a more usefull player. He does those kinds of things you don't see on TV. (I could be wrong, haven't seen him play in a long time.

    Roger I can't judge.

    Perez was for me this year too, one of the best of the Eredivisie. One of the most important players of AZ, while Huysegems was happy when he got some minutes. Still very dangerous for everyone. Sure his stamina will let him down, but we have Mitea, Babel, Rosenberg, Manucharyan, etc. who can play there too.
    Plus, one of the things, we didn't had last season, but we needed was experience.
     
  10. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    Yes I think experience is very important especially a veteran of Eredivisie like Kenneth Perez who by now the younger attacking players like Mitea, Manucharyan, Babel and Rosenberg can learn a thing or two from.

    Sadly what I said about him is true though. He has lost a LOT of pace and agility and sharpness and is not the same player he was a few years ago or even two years ago. At that time if Ajax could've signed him, he would've excited me but now... he'll still be okay but....

    Regarding Gabri, I don't know what you mean by he does things you don't see on TV? :-s
     
  11. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    This is tricky for me to explain in English, and I'm really tired, so I will try to explaing tomorrow. ;)
     
  12. And even outside his thread we can enjoy PLF's comparisons:roll: :lmao:

    This is in my opinion a decisive factor why I'd choose Huysegems(or even Rosenberg) instead of Perez. Rosenberg was rolling fine with Huntelaar and Rosales, but now a half 'dead' person in terms of condition just takes over at the left wing, if I'd had to play with Perez I would play him behind the strikers, WHAT does Perez have what makes him a good Ajax winger(at least at this age):eh: And then at the other wing, Gabri or Tom de Mul!?!
    Tom de Mul has potential definately but after a year of Vitesse you can't ask from him to be a first choice Ajax-winger IMO. I'm begging for Mitea/Rosales.

    Well PLF said enough about Gabri, way too mediocre for the Ajax starting line-up. I'm not so sure about Feyenoord either, I think we can make up for another PSV-AZ battle for the championship, I think this time it'll be a real close call, with Ajax just underneath PSV/AZ and Feyenoord around 6-10 points behind.

    From places 5-8 I expect place 5 to be a battle between Roda JC, Heerenveen and Utrecht(Groningen perhaps), but it doesn't really matter what happens from place 2-9, thanks to our 'great' playoff system. Looking forward to this season though8)
     
  13. Dominic

    Dominic Serie A Staff

    19 August 2003
    Netherlands
    Perez has actually been at his peak the past two years actually, his last two years were way better than the 'few years' ago.
     
  14. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    If you want to get that exact and technical then I'd say his peak was the season before last probably (2004/2005) but NOT last season which was another good one but we also clearly saw him decrease in some attributes (especially physical ones)

    But few years ago (meaning anywhere between 2-4 years ago) he had more speed, stamina and agility and was quicker to react than the Perez of today and last season and that combined with his good technical skills was a bigger headache for defenders than it will be now.

    So the only real exciting signing Ajax have made thus far for me is Stam who hopefully will bring solidity and stability to Ajax backline with all of his experience.

    Ogararu I won't talk about since I don't know much about but the other ones therefore (Roger, Gabri and Perez) aren't that exciting and Feyenoord then have made equally as good signings if not even slightly better.

    @Robin, no worries dude, you're biased but at least you know it and can admit it. :)

    Some can't and will always let that get in the way of their judgements but won't even admit it to themselves nor others so I give you credit for that. ;)
     
  15. joostebrood

    joostebrood Premiership

    4 March 2002
    Why has no one mentioned Ten Cate here?
     
  16. Big Boss

    Big Boss KJH = The Hunter!

    23 July 2003
    The Netherlands
    Ajax & Strasbourg
    That was a nice post there PLF, seems i heard right about Roger being slow, so that doesnt sound too good. Its hard for us signing players offcourse, especially experienced players wich we really needed, we have enough talented young players in the team, so we shouldnt sign even more. I would have really liked it if Davids would have came instead of Roger, maybe if he doesnt play much for Spurs we can still get him in midseason, Spurs do have plenty of other midfielders.

    I think what Robin meant about Gabri is that hes a player with good mentality and workrate, that doesnt show really on TV where u only get to see the goals and fancy moves (in highlights offcourse)
     
  17. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    Thanks Big Boss. Took a while to write that but I figured it might start up some good discussions since the thread was kinda a little flat before it. ;)

    Oh I see if that's what Robin meant then I'm already aware of that and yeh that's one of the best things about Gabri. But like I mentioned, Theo from what I've seen has the same attitude and is willing to work hard with exception that he seems to be more fit and have higher stamina (energy) and is less injury prone as well.

    I too would've loved to see Davids back at Amsterdam AreNa this season. :|
    But one can still hope. ;)

    Finally I think you brought up a very good point earlier.

    The biggest 2 things an Ajax fan should probably be excited about this new season is

    1) Arrival of Jaap Stam

    2) Departure of Guus Hiddink! :mrgreen: (The man is a GOD) and with him no longer there, PSV will not be as great as they were with him and this might open the door for AZ, Feyenoord and Ajax to get closer to them next season and make the title race hopefully more close. (IF these teams can get their act together and play well and get results consistently!)
     
  18. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Banned

    12 February 2005
    London
    So how well do you think Utrect are going to do in the coming season?

    What players have they brought in?
     
  19. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    Utrecht has bought Gregoor van Dijk of Roda JC and Cedric van der Gun of Borussia Dortmund. I hope van der Gun will have a very good season, because he has potential, but doesn't plays much. I think the goal of Utrecht is to get in the top 5, so they get in the play-offs for the CL. But the same goes for a lot of teams.


    Big Boss: Thanks, that's what I meant.
    PLF: 3) Arrival of Henk ten Cate. ;)
     
  20. Glavisted

    Glavisted Premiership

    20 July 2005
    Lima, Perú
    Yeah!, would be great, and maybe with Seedorf as a "Classic Holland Team"; I remember in the PS I re-signed players as Bergkamp, Stam, Seedorf, Davids, Kluivert, Van der Vaart, Kanú or Ibrahimovic to make a dutch "Dream Team" in Ajax. :mrgreen:

    Whatever I'm a supporter of PSV while Farfán is playing there, "vamos foquita". :)
     
  21. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    Hahah that doesn't surprise me Glav and I'm sure you supported Bayern in Germany until last year because of P. Guerrero and Pizarro but now will have a dillema since the first one has moved to HSV. :p
     
  22. Stringer Bell

    Stringer Bell Banned

    12 February 2005
    London
    robin does van der gun get injured a lot?
     
  23. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    He has been injured for a long time twice. But he isn't much injured if I remember right.
     
  24. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    Yeah he's injury prone (Though nothing extreme like Woodgate for example :lol:) and inconsistent as well. Those are two of his main problems which have held him back over the years.
     
  25. Amsterdammer

    Amsterdammer League 2

    22 February 2006
    Amsterdam
    Ajax & Barcelona
    PLF I think you are forgetting something important. The most important thing is the appearance of Henk Ten Cate. This is the brain of the succes of Barcelona. Rijkaard is only the front person. Ten Cate was the masterbrain himself. Many people don't know that. Ten Cate is known for getting players much better and playing beautiful football.

    Feyenoord is nothing you know and I'm not saying that because I'm from Amsterdam. I'm saying that because they don't have the the big image anymore to attract big players and they never win A THING. In more then 30 years they only won the title 3 times. They have become more sub-top. This year it's gonna be Ajax or PSV. AZ will be running behind them. Feyenoord behind AZ. Even AZ surpassed Feyenoord. AZ took all the talented players in the Netherlands while Feyenoord has been sleeping.

    This I think/hope will be the Ajax starting line-up:

    ----------------------Stekelenburg------------------------
    ---------------Stam---------------Vermaelen---------------
    --Ogararu-------------------------------------Emanuelson--
    -------------------------Maduro---------------------------
    ----------------Gabri-------------Roger-------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    ---De Mul--------------Huntelaar----------------Mitea-----
     
  26. Cloud1863

    Cloud1863 Premiership

    10 December 2004
    Stoke City
    I am quite looking forward to the start of the new season. I watched the highlights for a few matchdays last season as I couldnt watch live matches. I hope Setanta show live games this season, I don't understand how thy didn,t last season as they did have the highlights. They have Serie A, Liga 1 and the Bundesliga which you get live games on just no the Erdivisie. So I hope this year that changes.
     
  27. Glavisted

    Glavisted Premiership

    20 July 2005
    Lima, Perú
    Bayern's heart yet, but... go for Osasuna, HSV! :mrgreen:

    I couldn't watch the last season of Ajax, only could follow some matches of PSV in the Eredivisie, are you know what was the regular initial team of Ajax?, wouldn't be Heitinga, Rosales, Babel, Sneijder, Pérez or Grygera?
     
  28. Amsterdammer

    Amsterdammer League 2

    22 February 2006
    Amsterdam
    Ajax & Barcelona
    -Heitinga is a centre defender but Stam is already there
    -Rosales cant do any good in my eyes cause he never defeats a back trough the outside he mostly moves to the inside or already gives crosses like 20 metres before the backline
    -Babel is not a leftwinger nor a AJAX striker. He's a 4-4-2 striker like henry's style more
    -Sneijder is a good player but I don't like his physics
    -Perez is not a pure AJAX leftwinger. I'd rather see Mitea or Manucharyan who can defeat a back and gives crosses with their left feet
    -Grygera is the same story like Heitinga.....Stam baby!
     
    Last edited: 3 August 2006
  29. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    Grygera is not same story as Heitinga.

    He is a defensive-minded right back which would still be welcomed in the team when the team wants to play a bit more defensively and not have fullbacks that attack too much. (And yes he can also play in center of defence like Heitinga).

    Wesley Sneijder is not very strong. That's correct but he's still a much better player overall than a very disappointing Roger nowadays for reasons I've already mentioned about Roger above.

    Babel is not a left-winger by nature that's for sure. But due to the system Ajax play, there is no perfect position for him anyway and the fact that he's not an option for "CF" position, he's good to have on left-wing or right-wing sometimes but get him to act more like a SS than a WF. (I'm not saying for first team but to have in some matches and come as a sub).

    And yes I can see why you'd rather have Mitea or the young Armenian winger instead of Perez because they're much pacier and able to go past defenders with speed than the 32 year old but Perez has his OWN advantages over those two. (Such as more experience, better crosser/passer of the ball) and generally being a more complete player but obviously less fast.

    Rosales is a decent player but has his own limits. Nonetheless De Mul is still very RAW! He's a young guy with pace and decent skills but he's not much better than Rosales.

    Vermaelen is a promising young defender the Belgian but is also a bit weak and skinny for that position!! I'd rather have Heitinga at the back with Stam even though he's far from perfect.

    Finally all that stuff you told me about Feyenoord not having won something in long time... I know anyway, I don't know why you said it.

    The only reason I defended Feyenoord (even though I like Ajax better) is because Robin was taking a BIASED look at Ajax's signings vs. Feyenoord's signings and so I told him that they're not any better.. in fact I prefer Lucius and Huysegems over Ajax' Gabri and Perez who will be good for max one season more!

    And he understood me and admitted to being biased anyway so it's all good. 8)
     
    Last edited: 3 August 2006
  30. robin_007

    robin_007 Siem de Jong Fan

    1 September 2005
    Holland
    AFC Ajax
    I think you should not remove Vermaelen from the starting eleven. Talent of the year, he might seem skinny but I think he's physically stronger than you think, plus he is a good header an jumper (he won all the headers against VoH in the cup final :))

    Grygera is world-class, but sorry for him we have enough players for the starting eleven. But ten Cate said he has to go for the LB position, because he thinks Emanuelson defensively isn't good enough (for the rest he's good enough). He would be a perfect left- or rightback if we play 3-4-3 (Grygera---Stam---Heitinga, with Maduro just in front of Stam)

    I think we should give Rosales 1 more chance. He hasn't preformed brilliant, but against Feyenoord he's always on his best. :p Thats good enough for me. :p Since Huntelaar came to us, he gave much more assists.

    Agree about Sneijder and Babel (perfect sub, got a lot of points for us)

    Edit: From what I heard about Roger he isn't a great player. But he only signed for one year, and by then Davids will be transferfree. 8)
     
    Last edited: 3 August 2006

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