Is ronaldo the greatest modern day footballer?

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pes4lyfe

Champions League
4 July 2011
I dont mean C ronaldo. I mean Ronaldo.

THing is he doesnt get mentioned much because IMO he got bad injuries and his career was cut short and bogged down by these issues.

BUt overall for when he was young and at his peak and not injured he was truely phenonemanl. I think he is very overlooked.

And compared to Ronaldinho, Messi, C ronaldo, Zidane. Id say possibly better than all of them but I dont think he gets much reputation as these guys or did?
 
yes

edit: and with healthy knees, he would have become better than Maradona and Pele..
 
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He was absolutely PHENOMENAL like you said but I don't agree that he's under-rated because everyone knows how great he was! Very few for example would argue with you over who was better between him or Ronaldinho.

As great as he was, for me, Messi is even better! But of course Ronaldo wasn't helped by his bad knees and he wasn't the most 'professional' himself either.
 
Ronaldo was a fantastic player, the best striker ever.
but isn't only the injuries, he is brazilian, canirval, partys, dances...


messi is better, more decisive

ronaldo never won the CL
Messi never win the Worldcup

but in worldcup, ronaldo played with rivaldo,ronaldinho,cafu, r.carlos..fantastics player, and Argentina no is a good national team
 
Argentina has a bunch of great strikers, but has no deffense and, even worse, no midfield. Messi has to play as a playmaker most of the time and has no one else around...

Ronaldo was a beast and one of the most powerful strikers ever. But as a player, Messi and some other are on a much higher level. 73 goals AND 30 assists on a single season? Messi has beaten both not playing as an striker , it is just insane!

Messi has a larger influence in the pitch, can create the play from the midfield and end it. For all awesomness ronaldo had, he was just a striker and could play only as a striker and had minimal influence in the play of the team as a whole.

Plus, personally I even rate Romario above Ronaldo, simply because what ronaldo had in power Romario had it in his brain. Pure magic. I always prefer skill and vision over power. Ronaldo had incredible skill but you get what I'm saying. That's why players like Zidane and Xavi are above Ronaldo as well in my oppinion. And players like Henry are pretty near as well.
 
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Messi or Ronaldinho for me. Both just have/had it all at another level.

And yeah some of the Brazilian player's mindset ruined what could have been a world class career. Look at Adriano. He had the talent to become one of the best strikers but threw it all out.
 
drekkard said:
Argentina has a bunch of great strikers, but has no deffense and, even worse, no midfield. Messi has to play as a playmaker most of the time and has no one else around...
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well i can't agree with you here la Celeste had a lot of brilliant over ones the years for me the best was Redondo even nowadays they still have some talented ones Riquelme, Pastoré, Maxi Rodriguéz, Bolatti, Cambiasso, Lucho González, Di María.......


about the topic now: for me the best player there ever was is Marco Van Basten no one can come even close to him from the strikers you mentioned above he had it all Technique, Agility, Speed, Header Accuracy, Powerful shots, Leadership skills what ever you want he had it. The only thing is he was cut short at his prime he was only 27 when he retired too much injury for him also but whenever he was on the pitch you knew he was about to do something he influence over Milan in the 80's/90's was unforgettable, at his Prime he's Unmatched!
 
drekkard said:
Argentina has a bunch of great strikers, but has no deffense and, even worse, no midfield.
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Wow, I'm amazed you say they have had no defense and midfield. Messi's first major tournament for Argentina was the 2006 World Cup, between then and now they have had defenders like Roberto Ayala, Walter Samuel, Javier Zanetti, Demichelis, all these players have won big leagues in Europe and played in Champions League finals. Even the Argentine back up defenders during this time like Zabaleta, Sorín, Garay, Burdisso and Heinze are accomplished players.

In midfield again, you have players like Mascherano, Cambiasso (both CL winners), Gago, Aimar, Riquelme. And again you have some very good back up midfielders: Banega, Gaitan, Pastore, Di María, Maxi Rodriguez, there are also young players like Alvarez and Lamela who are coming through. Even if you didnt think any of these players were any good then they also have the option of moving a more attacking player like Lavezzi, Aguero or Tevez (some of the best players in the World Currently) into an attacking midfield role or even wide midfield role if they needed. And in all of this I havent even mentioned the vast number of talented domestic Argentine based players who have only played in the Argentine League, one of the strongest leagues in the world outside of Europe.

I think this pool of players is amongst the top 5 in the world, but even if you don't, ask yourself this: is it more limited than Uruguay (WC semi finalists and Copa America winners)? I dont think anyone would say Uruguay have a stronger pool of players (from which to pick a 23 man squad) than Argentina.
 
People tend to look to the players they know and tend to overrate them. One forgets players from the past.
IMO there are arguments to say that the following players were at least as good as Ronaldo.

Gento
Puskas
Di Stefano
Eusebio
Cruijff
Rensenbrink
Muller
Kempes
Rumenigge
Dalglish
Zico
Romario
Stoickhov
Preben Elkjaer Larsen
Van Basten
Cantona

I don't say they are all better or even as good as Ronaldo, but IMO he is overrated like George Best. Both of them were magnificent when in best form, but they never were long enough good to be considered among the all time greats imo. Most of the players in my list were myabe never as good as Ronaldo in that season with Barcelona, but were better overall.

That is also why IMO Best is seriously overrated.
 
yeah no doubt gerd but the thread said modern day footballers. Thought it was narrowed down to the last 10 or so years.
 
Bergkamp, Henry, Van Nistelrooy, C. Ronaldo, Messi, Raul, Del Piero...and so goes the list on...i would swap Ronaldo for any of them
 
Overall ability? Definitely Ronaldo. But I really like Batistuta. Deadly striker. Falcao now reminds me of him.
 
Zeem said:
Messi or Ronaldinho for me.
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Ronaldinho could have been the best in the whole history.
But up to now, Ronaldo is the best of post 90s football.
Though, Messi might "beat" him if he is as decisive in NT (which, contrarly as I read is still one of the best in the world). He still has plenty of time for it.
But up to now, Ronaldo is the best of all
 
I think that Ronaldo was one of the best strikers i have seen, but it's quite difficult to compare even strikers like the ones mentioned in this thread. a lot of players and a lot of different styles.
 
cfdh_edmundo said:
Wow, I'm amazed you say they have had no defense and midfield. Messi's first major tournament for Argentina was the 2006 World Cup, between then and now they have had defenders like Roberto Ayala, Walter Samuel, Javier Zanetti, Demichelis, all these players have won big leagues in Europe and played in Champions League finals. Even the Argentine back up defenders during this time like Zabaleta, Sorín, Garay, Burdisso and Heinze are accomplished players.

In midfield again, you have players like Mascherano, Cambiasso (both CL winners), Gago, Aimar, Riquelme. And again you have some very good back up midfielders: Banega, Gaitan, Pastore, Di María, Maxi Rodriguez, there are also young players like Alvarez and Lamela who are coming through. Even if you didnt think any of these players were any good then they also have the option of moving a more attacking player like Lavezzi, Aguero or Tevez (some of the best players in the World Currently) into an attacking midfield role or even wide midfield role if they needed. And in all of this I havent even mentioned the vast number of talented domestic Argentine based players who have only played in the Argentine League, one of the strongest leagues in the world outside of Europe.

I think this pool of players is amongst the top 5 in the world, but even if you don't, ask yourself this: is it more limited than Uruguay (WC semi finalists and Copa America winners)? I dont think anyone would say Uruguay have a stronger pool of players (from which to pick a 23 man squad) than Argentina.
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Exactly. Argentina is a team that has been loaded with talent at practically every position the past few years. The bottom line is this: Messi and co. haven't gotten the job done. Always easy to blame the coach when things don't go as planned. Maybe the problem is something or someone else.
 
My point is Ronaldo was a machine.

Power
Pace
Skill
Shooting.

Now you can say what u like about xavi, messi etc..and they are great players and Messi does score loads so prob is better.

but as a pure goal machine. I think Ronaldo is the best I ever seen. I mean for pure goals. He could beat you with pace, with a simple trick, change of pace, or if not he would run straight through you like Jona luma of rugby. Then anywhere within 20yards of goal he would smash ball into the corners.

If he was on the starting line up the team had 1 goal guranteed even before kick off. IMO he was just a pure goal machine. You could have 10 duds on a team but Ronaldo up front and still guarantee to score a goal or 2. As football is about scoring goals at end of day and one of hardet hings to do. Id say in regards to the ability to score a goal Ronaldo was the greatest this era.
 
gerd said:
People tend to look to the players they know and tend to overrate them. One forgets players from the past.
IMO there are arguments to say that the following players were at least as good as Ronaldo.

Gento
Puskas
Di Stefano
Eusebio
Cruijff
Rensenbrink
Muller
Kempes
Rumenigge
Dalglish
Zico
Romario
Stoickhov
Preben Elkjaer Larsen
Van Basten
Cantona

I don't say they are all better or even as good as Ronaldo, but IMO he is overrated like George Best. Both of them were magnificent when in best form, but they never were long enough good to be considered among the all time greats imo. Most of the players in my list were myabe never as good as Ronaldo in that season with Barcelona, but were better overall.

That is also why IMO Best is seriously overrated.
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I said modern era though so the above players are irrelvant to my point. As for Best he was an alcoholic and bit of a waster. I dotn know much about ronaldo or his partying lifestyle but his knee injuries were serious. And before then he was scoring goal every game for PSV/barca/Inter
 
gabe.paul.logan said:
Bergkamp, Henry, Van Nistelrooy, C. Ronaldo, Messi, Raul, Del Piero...and so goes the list on...i would swap Ronaldo for any of them
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For a pure goalscorign forward Id rahter have ronaldo than any of them though van nistelrroy at his peak was as much a machine.

Henry mayeb a better overall player but was not a pure striker though he had a spell where he developed into a great goalscorer.

Bergkamp was a more intelligent player and better team player and overall but again not an explosive goal machine.

Messi is Messi off course.

Raul and Del Piero Id rather have Ronaldo. Again id say them 2 are prob better overall players. But Ronaldo for his direct play and goalscoring is better.

allezlinter said:
Ronaldinho could have been the best in the whole history.
But up to now, Ronaldo is the best of post 90s football.
Though, Messi might "beat" him if he is as decisive in NT (which, contrarly as I read is still one of the best in the world). He still has plenty of time for it.
But up to now, Ronaldo is the best of all
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Ronaldinho prob overrated. He has fancy tricks and moments of magic but overall is he really that great consitently?
 
Off-topic, abput Argentina NT. I know all the names you all put, but luckily football is not about names, but about TEAM. And to build a team you need different pieces.

You can all try to watch again the matches of the last world cup for Argentina (and Messi was splendid in the first 4 matches even without scoring, mind you). Coach problems aside (and that was a huge problem), look at how unbalanced the team was in their lines. Milito was the starting CB when he wasn't even playing here at Barcelona because of his condition. Argentina missed Riquelme a lot, or any playmaker.

Redondo was one of the best DMF out there, but Messi hasn't played with him! I guess he wishes he did!

The players surrounding Messi in the last tournaments have been Cambiasso (in his worse shape ever), Banega and/or Mascherano. The problem is that the team is terribly unbalanced. And most of all, players are all cut by different patterns. So, in my opinion, as a TEAM Argentina has a terrible defense and a very average midfield. Don't strictly look at the names because that means nothing. Let's see:

- Defense: lacks a lot of speed and skill, so they can't play upwards with confidence (Germany can tell you about it). There are no real leaders at the back. Zanetti and Milito are clearly on their decline and should have been replaced years ago, but none of the youngsters that have been tested has performed. Argentina is producing a lot of talent upfront, but who's the last really good defender you can remember?

Plus, the men playing at defense are all of them used to packed defending and are not really that good with the ball in their feet. Every time the team needs to start a play they simply pass it to a DMF or a midfielder who has came to the back to receive. So, defenders don't really add to the creation and suffer a lot when they leave spaces behind, because they're not used to it.

- Midfield: Here the problem is quite obvious. Playmaking. Mascherano is a genius of positional and defensive play, but don't ask him to move the team. Banega is injured and even before his serious injury he was one of those players who just can't perform well in two consecutive matches. He disappears too often from the pitch. He's a good player, but that's it.

Cambiasso doesn't add much there, I think his days at the NT should be over. Argentina needs 2 players who can pass the ball there, and Cambiasso has never been this kind of player. But who else is there that can play creative? No one! They need a Riquelme there. Someone who can play from behind by moving the team, not just running with the ball.

- Forwards: The rest of "stars" of Argentina are all forwards and all of them players who shine in individual concepts. Di Maria (it's a forward, not a midfielder, and he never performs far from goal), Lavezzi, Aguero, Higuain, Tévez... all of them players that are good carrying the ball and running, but not passing the ball or creating chances. They can all score and drible but they add very little to playmaking or creating chances. None of them is specially good at associating with the rest. And that's what makes the problem in the midfield even bigger. They depend on Messi beating 2-3 defenders and dashing a pass to create something. That just won't work. Nowadays a single player (even if it's Messi) can't beat a team.

I've watched all matches of Argentina in the last 4 years, and since Riquelme went away (and even when he was there) the problem has been the connection between lines. They all play different things and their qualities are too individual, not collective.

Here's a list of national teams that have much better Defense-Midfield than Argentina: Spain, Germany, Netherlands, France, Brazil, Italy, Uruguay, Chile and even teams like England, Russia, Ivory Coast, Portugal or Paraguay can be as good or even better than Argentina (not counting forwards here, remember). Luckily for Argentina, their forwards are so good that they could win any of these teams due to a strike of genius.

Here are the final questions: out of forwards, who are the latest Argentina players to enter the team in the Midfield and Defense lines? Can you name anyone who's younger than 30 years and can be considered a world class player there?
 
pes4lyfe said:
For a pure goalscorign forward Id rahter have ronaldo than any of them though van nistelrroy at his peak was as much a machine.

Henry mayeb a better overall player but was not a pure striker though he had a spell where he developed into a great goalscorer.

Bergkamp was a more intelligent player and better team player and overall but again not an explosive goal machine.

Messi is Messi off course.

Raul and Del Piero Id rather have Ronaldo. Again id say them 2 are prob better overall players. But Ronaldo for his direct play and goalscoring is better.



Ronaldinho prob overrated. He has fancy tricks and moments of magic but overall is he really that great consitently?
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I think you need to change the title of your thread. Because you keep refering to Ronaldo as a goal machine. Indeed he was. But he did nothing else. You put "footballer" on the title. If you had put "scorer", then Ronaldo may be in the top 5 ever list of scorers, yes. But as a footballer, you have to consider a lot more things than only goals.

Assists, contribution to teamplay, leadership, consistency, injuries (it's sad, but Ronaldo spent too much time injured, probably without injuries he would have been even more amazing, but I think injuries limited him to a poacher. One of the best ever, but just that). If you keep saying the word "footballer", there's no doubt Henry, Zidane, Del Piero, Raul, Ronaldinho, Van Basten, Xavi... they are better footballers than Ronaldo. And others like Cantona, Giggs, Bergkamp or Batistuta can compare to him.

Mind you, I watched the best season of Ronaldo live at the stadium. I was absolutely mesmerized and some days you just had to put your hands on your head when he scored. But I tell you, the other 80 minutes he was quite unnoticed. Just like Romario. But whilst Ronaldo was an athlete and had enormous power, Romario was a real genius. He did things no one else did. Not by being faster or stronger, but by being a genius. He saw things no one else saw. I tend to admire people who depends basically on skills and brains.

So, in my oppinion, even Romario was better than Ronaldo. Though that's just a personal opinion, and I would love to have BOTH of them in my team! Hey, in fact I had both of them in my team! I've been so freacking lucky to watch the players I've watched in the last 20 years. Wow!

Players like Zidane, Ronaldinho, Messi, Xavi, Henry, Del Piero... they are constantly influencing the team and lifting the entire squad to a higher level. Anyone playing aside Zidane or Ronaldinho got better as a player, instantly. Can you say the same about Ronaldo? Hardly.
 
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pes4lyfe said:
Ronaldinho prob overrated. He has fancy tricks and moments of magic but overall is he really that great consitently?
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Well, I remember games with the PSG where he was stuning
Imo, if he had deceided to train seriously and be part of a team instead of playing as he wanted, he'd been one of the greatest if not the best in history. He had the capacity to be it
 
drekkard said:
I think you need to change the title of your thread. Because you keep refering to Ronaldo as a goal machine. Indeed he was. But he did nothing else. You put "footballer" on the title. If you had put "scorer", then Ronaldo may be in the top 5 ever list of scorers, yes. But as a footballer, you have to consider a lot more things than only goals.

Assists, contribution to teamplay, leadership, consistency, injuries (it's sad, but Ronaldo spent too much time injured, probably without injuries he would have been even more amazing, but I think injuries limited him to a poacher. One of the best ever, but just that). If you keep saying the word "footballer", there's no doubt Henry, Zidane, Del Piero, Raul, Ronaldinho, Van Basten, Xavi... they are better footballers than Ronaldo. And others like Cantona, Giggs, Bergkamp or Batistuta can compare to him.

Mind you, I watched the best season of Ronaldo live at the stadium. I was absolutely mesmerized and some days you just had to put your hands on your head when he scored. But I tell you, the other 80 minutes he was quite unnoticed. Just like Romario. But whilst Ronaldo was an athlete and had enormous power, Romario was a real genius. He did things no one else did. Not by being faster or stronger, but by being a genius. He saw things no one else saw. I tend to admire people who depends basically on skills and brains.

So, in my oppinion, even Romario was better than Ronaldo. Though that's just a personal opinion, and I would love to have BOTH of them in my team! Hey, in fact I had both of them in my team! I've been so freacking lucky to watch the players I've watched in the last 20 years. Wow!

Players like Zidane, Ronaldinho, Messi, Xavi, Henry, Del Piero... they are constantly influencing the team and lifting the entire squad to a higher level. Anyone playing aside Zidane or Ronaldinho got better as a player, instantly. Can you say the same about Ronaldo? Hardly.
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True points. tell me more about Romario. I just remember he had a good finish and was always in right place at right time. he had lack of power/pace/strenght?

As for Ronaldo. yeh I guess IMO he is the greatest explosive goal scorign machine in my era of watching football.

THe best footballer well based on many overall factors I guess not but consdering football is about goals Id say perhaps so.

Id say having ronaldo on starting line up gurantess you more likely to score than having zidane. Zidane may influence macth more and create more chances for others but no gurantee for goals.

Im sure if you are in a team and have Ronaldo up fornt no matter the score you always know if u get the balll up front there is a great chance he will score, that must be a good feeling to have as a teammate.

With raul, bergakamp, zidane etc. Youd feel if u get the ball to them theres a chane they can create soemthing. BUt Imo with Ronaldo you feel if you can get the ball to him theres a chacne hell score and thats more important really.

but I see the point that over a whole 90min game in many areas of the game he was not effective. But at his peak he could pick up the ball anywhere 50yards from gaol and just run straight thourgh and make himself chacnes. Its rare.
 
allezlinter said:
Well, I remember games with the PSG where he was stuning
Imo, if he had deceided to train seriously and be part of a team instead of playing as he wanted, he'd been one of the greatest if not the best in history. He had the capacity to be it
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He just reminds me of a showman more than a footballer, maybe due to his funny apperance?

When I think Zidane. I think serious footballer with class and great skill.

When I think Ronaldinho. I think funny guy with the cool tricks.
 
drekkard said:
Plus, personally I even rate Romario above Ronaldo, simply because what ronaldo had in power Romario had it in his brain. Pure magic. I always prefer skill and vision over power. Ronaldo had incredible skill but you get what I'm saying. That's why players like Zidane and Xavi are above Ronaldo as well in my oppinion. And players like Henry are pretty near as well.
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Ronaldo was a very intelligent player too. His passing and vision made his Corinthians career, at times when he could barely move but was still so unpredictable. But yes I get your point.
 
drekkard said:
Off-topic, abput Argentina NT. I know all the names you all put, but luckily football is not about names, but about TEAM. And to build a team you need different pieces.
...........
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you're definitely right at this point there's no connection between any of the lines & no fluidity in the team's display. That has been a serious problem since Róman left and every attempt to replace him failed miserably not even Messi was capable of filling his role to tell just you how much important he was for the team. Not any coaches or Maradona's faults like some idiots are saying (even though he was crazy enough to play in a 4-2-4 against Germany) the didn't have that much of team-players in the team that's what was primarily wrong!

As for this question
drekkard said:
Can you name anyone who's younger than 30 years and can be considered a world class player there?
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i would've said Pastoré but he's not mature or constant enough to take on that role so we just have to wait if he'll ever fill up those enormous shoes, from what i've seen he have that leadership skills but the mental & form part keeps holding him back. This season when in form he was absolutely brilliant he was handed PSG's keys and showed up as expected & more he created goal opportunities, made assists, scored goals ;basically just took over the team offense so i can't wait to see more of him in these coming years one day i expect him to be the best in the world
 
I think it's much easier to score 40+ goals a season today when playing for the big 2 in Spain than it was for Ronaldo to dominate the way he did.

Like it or not, La Liga is outrageously unbalanced right now - this year we had the most goals for a team in a season (beating last years record) most goals by individuals, most points (beating last years record) and so forth. It's not competitive if a team can beat 18 of the other teams by an AVERAGE of 3 goals a match.

Hence.

As good as Messi is, I can't call him the greatest until he plays somewhere else. Ronaldo did it in multiple countries, but over a shorter time frame.

The best player that I've seen over the past 25 years or so was Zidane. Did it everywhere, did it for his national team, did it in the CL final - he ran the show.

Ronaldinho had all the talent and physical attributes to emulate Zidane's dominance of the game, but only managed it briefly.
 
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