Can you be a top pro footballer just by being fast

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pes4lyfe

Champions League
4 July 2011
I mean take a 100m sprinter. Say he has decent football skills why cant he be a top player in the world?

With that kinda speed surely he would be unstoppable on the wing or up front for breaking off side trap.

I read Darren Cambpell used to play football but he didnt make it pro.

So, why is speed not enough?

OR do you think it is, would players like Owen, Walcott etc...even be pro players if it were not for their speed. There football skills alone are not good enough and physciques to lightweight?
 
Speed ALONE isn't enough to be a GREAT player simply because it's not like the rest of the people you play against (your opponents) are slow unfit bastards. All of these guys are great athletes at the highest levels and most have good if not very good acceleration and sprint.

Also beating the offside trap takes massive intelligence, mental attributes like anticipation, timing, precision and decision making so if a guy is doing it on a regular basis like Henry and Owen used to do, it's not like they're pulling it off only because of their massive speed. It's only one of the attributes required.

And again I fail to see why a guy who is super fast would be unstoppable on the wing when chances are his delivery/crossing/vision and passing is average if not poor.

So for me, it's like this, speed helps and it helps BIG time! Are there footballers who wouldn't have made it as pros at highest level if it hadn't been for their speed? HELL yeah! But is speed alone enough to get you into Champions League let's say? No.

David Odonkor is actually the perfect example in my head. This guy played for German National Team, Dortmund, Betis and at times at highest level early in his career but at the end of the day, he was nothing but a sprinter who would've perhaps been better off pursuing that sport. He had below average ball control, NO footballing IQ (which is most important thing) so no vision, bad decisions, poor crossing and was overall not really a football player but an extremely fast runner. How did he end up? Well I don't even know where he plays now, that tells you how successfull he's been in recent years.

There are others like Walcott and Gabby Agbonlahor who are good players but without their super speed, they would NOT be playing 1st division. They'd be more like 2nd division players.

Julius Aghahowa (Nigerian FW who used to play for Shakhtar) was another one! Hell a young Darius Vassell kinda too and also notice at what level he played (England Int'l) and how ended up? Because when speed is pretty much ALL you have, then when you get start to get slower and you inevitably will, you got nothing else to rely on.

p.s. How good would Usain Bolt be on the football pitch? Not very effective at all I'd say unless there's a huge counter-attack and that's assuming his control/dribbling is decent enough to not kick ball too far away or out which it probably is given that he's Jamaican. :P
 
very good points mate.

How would you say one develops a great footballing IQ? Just from having a natural decent level of intelligence plus a lot of matchplay/games experience?
 
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Yeah I'd say that's a pretty good standard.

And if you look at the world's BEST players, guys like Xavi, Messi, Modric, Ronaldo, Iniesta, Sneijder, Casillas, Xabi Alonso, Dani Alves, Thiago Silva etc. etc. you'll instantly notice that they are all SUPER smart players regardless of position and role! I don't know what the IQ level for these guys is, but I'm willing to bet all of them are at LEAST above average if not higher and in many of their cases, quite a lot higher.

And so in a case like Ronaldo's or Dani Alves, their SPEED is what has helped them tremendously become the players they are, but if they didn't have that high intelligence and great mental attributes like vision, decision making, anticipation, etc. they would be quite ordinary. They'd be yet another fast but mediocre player. Something the English 2nd division is full of.

I'd say the smarter you are the better your chances but of course at the end of the day it comes to match day experience, hard work, and developing those individual attributes such as vision and anticipation through training and matches and following role models and being coached right. Literally 100's of variables basically.

But yeah look at the world's best players. Is there a single one who doesn't seem typically sharp or quite dumb? Not at all. They're all quite intelligent and luckily for them, also had the physique and athleticism to physically express themselves and play up to the level their 'brains' dictate and envision.
 
yeh all I can think of is how do you explain:

Gazza and Rooney lol.

BUt think of players like Pirlo, De Boers, Gullit, Van Bastens, Klinsmann, RIkjard, Guardiola etc...you can see these guys also became in some cases great managers. So they are not so dumb guys.
 
Those guys are all really smart in my opinion INCLUDING Rooney and Gascoigne.

Remember we're talking about footballing IQ and intelligence, not life-decisions like drinking, and being undisciplined.

When you watch Gazza or Rooney play, there's no doubt, these guys are anything BUT dumb. They can be a genius in fact at times and absolutely mesmerize you with their vision and intelligence! Now the fact that one is a drunkard for example lol has more to do with other problems I'd say like lack of control, emotional instability, upbringings, childhood, family/personal problems etc. I don't think Gazza is at the stage he's in his life because of a lack of intelligence at all, I'd say he was quite a smart man in fact. Just another one who unfortunately didn't use it well and let his weaknesses get the better of him.

Name me an actual guy who's quite thick but made it huge. Cuz you'll notice even the dirty DMF's who are all aggression were quite smart. Guys like Mark van Bommel and Roy Keane, Nigel de Jong, none dumb. Above average definitely but maybe not that smart except MvB who'd I'd say is VERY smart and probably will go on to make a great manager.
 
PLF said:
Those guys are all really smart in my opinion INCLUDING Rooney and Gascoigne.

Remember we're talking about footballing IQ and intelligence, not life-decisions like drinking, and being undisciplined.

When you watch Gazza or Rooney play, there's no doubt, these guys are anything BUT dumb. They can be a genius in fact at times and absolutely mesmerize you with their vision and intelligence! Now the fact that one is a drunkard for example lol has more to do with other problems I'd say like lack of control, emotional instability, upbringings, childhood, family/personal problems etc. I don't think Gazza is at the stage he's in his life because of a lack of intelligence at all, I'd say he was quite a smart man in fact. Just another one who unfortunately didn't use it well and let his weaknesses get the better of him.

Name me an actual guy who's quite thick but made it huge. Cuz you'll notice even the dirty DMF's who are all aggression were quite smart. Guys like Mark van Bommel and Roy Keane, Nigel de Jong, none dumb. Above average definitely but maybe not that smart except MvB who'd I'd say is VERY smart and probably will go on to make a great manager.
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well yeh I see your point. Perhaps Gazza and Rooney do have more intelligence in their brain and not just on the football picth than we give credit for.

Its just their upbringing plus there lifestyle choices we conclude they lack intelligence but perhaps and most likely they are not that dumb at all.
 
Yeah.

The interesting thing about this and the NON-surprising part in my opinion is that if you pay attention, this is the same for all sports.

Look at who the world's BEST are in Tennis, Basketball, Hockey, UFC, etc.

Roger Federer, Djokovic, Dwayne Wade, Kobe, Sydney Crosby, Georges St. Pierre, different sport athleletes, different skillsets, all super athletes great body but two common denominators! Intelligence and hard work! None of these guys at the top of the chain are dumb guys, all very intelligent in fact.
 
Good posts Sina.
I actually heard that Usain Bolt is a pretty good football player, he loves football and he is a good friend of Stoke City's Ricardo Fuller. But i see what you want to say, for a non football player Bolt is a good football player, but he's not good enough to be a very good (let alone top) player.

I think you are underestimating Walcott. At times yopu can see that he has pretty good technical skills, but his decision making is rather poor. I still think that he can become one of the better English players (don't forget that has had loads of injuries).
 
Theo Walcott is a prime example of being a pro footballer just by being fast.

Or as Sina said, Odonkor.

I'd never actually watched a match Odonkor was part of so I watched a few videos on Youtube of him. Obviously they don't tell the whole story but when even the supposedly 'best of' compilation videos make him look terrible you have to wonder how he managed a career in the sport.

People like him make me think if I had the physique and fitness (and the determination) to become a professional footballer I'd actually be pretty good. My touch, passing, crossing and shooting is far better than Odonkor's (and I'm not being bigheaded).
 
Thing is, even sitting on the bench for most of his career and never actually making it "big" by any means - David Odonkor still managed to become everybody's darling in 2006, generated a couple of millions being transferred to Betis and most certainly made more money than 99% of sprinters do in their lives. Because, you know ... football ...

He plays for Aachen now in the second division. Of course, he ain't starting for them on a regular basis. Even now, at 27, he still has huge deficits in precision and ball control.

So, to answer the question: Pace alone is certainly not enough to make an impact on a professional level, but can be just enough to get your hands on buckets full of money.
You might as well try your luck in sprinting. Maybe you'll become one of the top 5 guys that can actually grab a decent sponsorship deal or win a couple of grands at a meeting. But what are the odds?
 
It's an interesting question and PLF nailed it with the comment about it being who you play against.

Gabby Agbonlahor scored literally 100's of goals at youth/reserve level by being so much faster. But when he made the step up to 'real' defenders, he's now shown for what he is.

I think, perhaps, a more interesting question is how good can a player be in today's football WITHOUT pace? There are a couple of positions that you can get away with it such as deep lying midfielders, (see Scholes, Paul) but any full backs, wingers and forwards I would argue need pace to be genuinely effective. And more and more centre backs need pace too.

The best example I can think of is someone like Joe Cole. He can beat almost any full back with skill and create half a yard of space, but he is slow so unless he does something at that split second, the full back will be back on him again. Hence Joey doesn't work so well on the wings anymore.
 
it is also worth mentioning that being fast on a football pitch is a completely different thing than being being a fast runner.
usain bolt would obviously destroy messi on a 100 meters plan run.
but ask them to cover an entire pitch (from one goal line to another) with a ball on their feet and messi will humiliate bolt (by the time messi covers the entire pitch bolt will still be at the midfield line).

the rotation of the ankle, the weight distribution, the lenght of the steps.... all theese factors are completely different when u're running while carrying a ball. when u run with a ball u always have to make short steps (ideally the knee mustn't go further than the waist) and u wanna carry most of your weight on the foot that doesn't touch the ball.

bottom line, is the touch that makes a football player fast, not the strenght of his legs. and pure speed is almost irrelevant on a football pitch.
pes4lyfe said:
I mean take a 100m sprinter. Say he has decent football skills why cant he be a top player in the world?

With that kinda speed surely he would be unstoppable on the wing or up front for breaking off side trap.
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not really, mate. your touch (your sensibility in handling the ball) is what makes u unstoppable on the sidelines.
and speed is also irrelevant when it comes anticipating the off side shift. if u wanna learn how to "play" with the defensive lines (catching them off guard), u gotta work on your positioning and reflexes, not on your speed. ;)
 
yeh also i think your acceleation from standing over 10-20yds is more important..

Its rare to run +30-50m often....and if you do most likely you gonna have to have skills to beat 2-3 players unless your on a counter attack run thorugh on goal etc..
 
Great points guys.

Yeah I'd say acceleration rather than Top Sprint Speed is certainly more important! Because you often need just that quick burst to get past a player and then either shoot or deliver a great pass/cross. Since it's a team sport it's not like you'll keep the ball personally for that long or have all that space to run half the pitch unless it's a rare situation like a counter-attack or something. It's all about that one movement which creates space before releasing the ball.

@Gerd, nice info on Usain Bolt!

In regards to Theo, I don't really under-rate him bro. I like him and think he can become quite good as well. I didn't mean to disrespect him by that post. I see him and Lennon as the same and they're two good players. They have other tools in their arsenal but there's no doubt, they would NOT be where they are if it wasn't for their speed. Because their other attributes are decent at best (like technique) but not outstanding and it is their sheer speed and acceleration that has them playing for two of the best teams in England.

For me though, David Odonkor literally is THE BEST and Pure example of this discussion. Not guys like Walcott or Lennon or Agbonlahor because they're actually 'decent' players with some other interesting attributes.

But David Odonkor was just HOPELESS! Anyone who watched him at Dortmund for example or German NT could see this guy is SO LUCKY to be on the pitch becauase he has NO vision. No positioning. No football IQ. Poor passing. Average Crossing and poor touches which he gets away with at times because he's so fast! Lol

@RentalKid said it best though, nonetheless look at what he achieved! He went to World Cup! Got some caps for German NT! Played for big clubs in two of the best leagues! Made a lot of money but at the end of the day it catches up to you! He's 27 and playing for a mediocre 2nd division club and not even a regular starter!

@BeachRyan, I think that is an interesting question and I agree. Good example about Joe Cole type of player these days as well. There are some who play on the wing in modern football today who get away with it due to sublime skill or excellent delivery (Think about David Beckham too who's different from Cole but never had that TOP speed). But yah bar the goalkeeper and the playmaker in center of midfield, more and more with each passing day, you need SPEED because the game is becoming more and more athletic and physical. And if you DONT have speed, then you better be absolutely AMAZING otherwise! You better be the very BEST at what you're good at like David Pizarro, Pirlo, Xavi and co.

And although you can still be a fairly big tall target man type of striker, more and more you find they have been replaced by men who are just as strong and tall but quite a lot faster and more athletic (Lot of African players) and many of them are not 'slow' anymore but have 'decent' speed.

So I would say you can get away with it if you're amazing otherwise in the playmaking role in center of midfield and as a goalie, and less so as a tall target man striker and central defender but still do-able. But when it comes to other positions like winger or full-back or fast striker which every team has, then forget about it! These days, if you don't have the pace, think about another career! That's almost the #1 requisite!

@Matherto, well said and I agree. And I actually think the same for me. But of course if we DID have the speed and the physicality (and of course the determination to make it as a pro, it's not easy), then we would be very good because we'd have it all! :LOL:

Unfortunately our weaknesses are big and not something you can really compensate for either unless you're as good as Xavi or Scholes!

@Ben, Ben that's spot on! Was gonna say that too. Dribbling with ball completely different but still relevant imo
 
i watched youtube clips of Odonkor due to his pace he gets in so many good positions often, problem is he always messed up lol.

If he had good techincal ability he would actually be better than Ronaldo or messi and scoring/assistign everygame as he was always getting in amazing situations/positions....but some of his final balls, crosses, shots or tricks were laughable and worse than an amatuer schoolboy. I could do better.

Like his game is laughable, hell make a mad run and beat the whole team run on to a lofted ball, be in on goal at an angle then hit the shot out for a thorw in lol, how did he get to play for big clubs or even germany?

He had no end product at all.
 
Yeah that was typical of him. Use his speed to get 1-on-1 and then shoot far, ugly and wide lol.

I think the reason he played for quite awhile at BvB and so got the exposure to play in NT as well is that at the time, he was very young. And when you're young, you're always given chances as people think, hey maybe he can improve, maybe he'll be blah blah... it's for that reason that youngsters in general are over-rated because people always rate them on what they COULD be rather than what they are. But soon enough, Dortmund coaches I think realized this guy is never gonna get any better and that he wouldn't be missed.

p.s. I just remembered Bernard Mendy! The French Right-back! Played for PSG! Played for France! RIDICULOUS speed! I still remember when he made Roberto Carlos (who was incredibly fast himself in his peak look like a turtle in a sprint vs. him in France match vs. Brazil), he too was a VERY limited player who'd NEVER played at the highest level had it not been for PURE pace. H didn't have much football IQ and was very mediocre in everything else. Him and Odonkor are two good examples. David being best one for me.
 
Ah i seee what you mean they were like this boy has unbelivable pace and works hard and can get back and up real fast, if he can develop his game he will be lethal...but it never happened hence at 27 he plays low level.
 
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