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Does Italy really needs Totti?

Discussion in 'Football' started by lo zio, 19 July 2007.

  1. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    http://wwwrm1.ansa.it/site/notizie/awnplus/english/news/2007-07-12_112116397.html


    ... at this point i just hope totti won't wear the azzurra shirt anymore...... he really doesn't deserve it.... and let's be honest, he doesn't even care about it.

    this situation makes me think to those silly people (like many italian chauvinists) who accuse the french national team not to be really "french".

    well, french players, no matter wich is their ethnic origin, still show their pride each time they wear the french national team shirt. and u can clearely see, looking at the will they show on the pitch, how proud they are to wear that shirt.

    it makes me think that Zidane (just to make an example) is a real french, while francesco isn't a real italian...:roll:
     
  2. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Well, he's not the brighest kid of the class...
    On the other hand he might be forced by Roma.
    It is well known that big clubs don't like to see their star players playing for the national team.
    As for is value for the squadra azzuri...when he's good, he's very good...but most of the times he is something of liability...
    I think 70% of the time the squadra can do without him, but the remaining 30%...
     
  3. Rocky

    Rocky League 1

    11 May 2005
    With regards to the French, it doesn't matter what origins their players have or if they're black or white, Arab or Senegalese etc. If they can proudly state, "I'm French" they have every right to play for their national team. If they feel they are French, they're French and we can't tell them otherwise. I actually think it's great that the French national team has so many players from different ethnic backgrounds. With regards to Totti, he'll say "I'm Roman" before he can proudly state "I'm Italian." Not like we really need Totti anyway, besides Euro 2000 he's pretty laid an egg every other tournament. For Francesca, it's club>country.
     
  4. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    i do agree with both of u guys. Gerd, u're right, often clubs put pressure on their players, trying to persuade them not to play for their national teams, but this time is different. it was a totti decision, the club didn't force him.
    Actually he doesn't even took a real decision.... and that's what piss me off.
    i mean, that's nothing wrong in saying "no" to your national team. u could be too tired or old to play so many matches in a season, u could have some problems with the coach, or u could just don't feel that special feeling wearing that shirt (as rocky correctly wrote francesco is "more roman than italian".... wich sounds ridiculous to me but whatever...). He didn't say " i won't play anymore for italy" (maldini already did it but nobody would ever blame him.... and now probably nesta will do the same); he said "i don't know WHEN i'll decide to play again for italy". That's really unacceptable.

    he's a great player, better than most of u guys might think (as it's a fact that on the international stage he always "underperformed"... don't know if this word does really exists, but anyway i mean that in the international competitions he never played at his usual level, so most of the people outside italy just have no idea how good he is)....
    ....but still, as i said before, i really hope not to see him anymore wearing the azzurra shirt.
     
  5. codpiece

    codpiece Romanista

    12 December 2002
    Houston
    It's important to remember that Totti played the end of the 2006 season and the World Cup and all of the 2006/2007 season with metal pins in his ankle.

    It is true he is not the brightest bulb, but I can see where he is coming from in this regard. Now that he's won it all for his country, what's the motivation for him to make himself available for ALL the games for Italy just to get the shit kicked out of him (he's almost always the most fouled player). Unfortunately, I don't believe any player should have the luxury to do what he's doing, but I don't question his thinking in this instance. In the end, it'll come down to how much Italy (and Donadoni) value Totti and what he can do for the team.
     
  6. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    true and i really admired the will he showed by forcing his rehabilitation program, just to join the world cup :):applause:

    well mate, i'd say u don't play for your national team for your own glory... at least not only. when u play for your country, u do it for "your" people, u do it for seeing a silly, childish 26 year old guy crying like an idiot for your victory (or your loss).
    so it's not about motivations. eitherway why so many world champions (italians, french, brazilians) are still playing for their national teams?

    But anyway, mate, it doesn't matter; if francesco doesn't feel this, then it's a good move to stop playing for italy, and i would have no problems with it. What really piss me off is that he's not saying (at least till now, in 1 month he'll have to take a decision) "i won't play anymore for italy".
    he's saying "i don't know, maybe later, maybe i'll be back for the most important matches". that's really unfair. He's disrespecting his teamates. Is Del piero an idiot? is he a second pick? and what about pirlo or buffon or cannavaro? Why should they play boring qualification or friendly matches?

    u don't wanna play for italy anymore? ok, no prob, but TAKE A DECISION, as u're not a "prima voce" in an opera or the "etoile" of La Scala.... u're just part of a team.... if u still want to.
     
    Last edited: 19 July 2007
  7. Ad16

    Ad16 Premiership

    13 November 2006
    "Totti has 58 caps and has scored nine international goals."

    Surely this isn't good enough for an international playing in his position? Don't get me wrong, I know he's a top player, but maybe he isn't that important to the Italian national team anyway...
     
    Last edited: 19 July 2007
  8. codpiece

    codpiece Romanista

    12 December 2002
    Houston
    Totti is not a goalscorer (which is funny, considering his recent club form the past few years). He is a trequartista. He is the pivot man for Italy, the man who links play. He has immense vision and unbelievable (perhaps best ever?) 1st time passing ability. This sometimes doesn't come off with the national team, as his teammates are not accustomed to his style of play.

    @ lo zio
    I wasn't saying I agree with him (in fact, I said I don't think any player has the luxury to do what he's doing). But, what you said about playing for your national team is kinda fairy-tale dreaming. Yes, in a perfect world, players would play for their national team for honor and pride alone. However, when you make millions and millions of dollars playing for your club, you would like to maximize the length of your career as much as possible, no?

    Anyway, just the thoughts of a slightly biased romanista.
     
  9. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    well mate, the point is that he's not a foward. he's an advanced midfielder. now it's 4 years he's playing as a foward - and that's the reason why he didn't scored so many goals - (because he likes to score goals and because his coaches, capello first and then spalletti decided to place him as a foward).
    Sure he's a good foward (good dribbling and a terrific shot) but it's really a shame to see him playing in that position.
    because what makes him one of the greatest talents in the last 20 years is his vision, his passing game.
    He's not a van nistellroy or a toni.... he's a zidane, a juninho, a riquelme, a maradona (i'm not sayng he's as good as maradona, but that's his role).

    also juninho and zidane have a great shot, but they never were so silly to decide to play as a foward.

    u see mate, that's why i wrote before that most of the people have no idea about who is francesco totti....... and that's really a pity :(
    he was one of the greatest advanced midfielder of the last 20 years..... but as a foward, he's nothing more than a good player.
     
  10. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    when i started writing my previous post, u hadn't posted yet..... funny how we wrote the same things :)


    i don't know if it's so unreal or kinda fairy tale, mate. Afterall, they don't get paid to play for italy... so what could be their purpose?... i mean, did u see gattuso, pirlo, cannavaro faces after the match against germany? did u remember their expressions, their eyes? Clearely they weren't thinking to their bankary accounts :D


    that's for sure. And i would respect his choice if he would decide to retire from national team competitions. :)
    But i can't accept his attitude when he says "well, probably i'll beback for most important matches".


    you're not biased at all mate ;).
    a biased roma fan would have flame me with the most terribles insults, for accusing Totti :mrgreen::)



    edit: sorry for doubleposting :)
     
    Last edited: 19 July 2007
  11. tuta

    tuta Marseillais

    21 November 2004
    France
    Marseille
    France's coach (Domenech) decided to keep chosing Makelele while the guy wasn't sure to continue his international carrier. Makelele is our best defensive midfieleder, he still plays in the starting eleven. It's not the player who has to say if yes or no he joins the selection, it's the coach who decides if he is good enough.

    My point of view is very simple. Totti is one of the best italian player (if not the best) so I he has to play for Italy until he is not pick anymore (or good enough). He can't choose when to play, he has to be there all the matches or just stop playing football :D. It's an honor, dammit !!!
     
  12. nt89

    nt89 OUR WORK IS NEVER OVER

    14 February 2005
    L'Aquila (Italy)
    FC Juventus
    Totti ? definitely not a champion...
    he won just a scudetto with a great team and coach (capello)
    in the world cup he was ridicolous...
    never decisive, never fantastic, overrated player, i'm happy of this decision but i don't like in the way it came, the truth is that Donadoni isn't ready to be the world champion coach...
     
  13. codpiece

    codpiece Romanista

    12 December 2002
    Houston
    http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=446787&cc=5901

    Italian Totti announces international retirement

    ROME, July 20 (Reuters) - AS Roma striker Francesco Totti said on Friday that he had retired from international football.



    Totti, who made 58 appearances for Italy scoring nine goals, said he was taking an extended break from the national team after they won the World Cup last July and he has now decided to quit the Azzurri completely.


    'The word finished is ugly but I have taken this decision to end the chapter with the national team for various physical reasons and not technical,' the 30-year-old told a news conference.


    'I have weighed up for a year after the World Cup what to do and I have decided to finish with the national team in order not to create problems for the Azzurri staff. I am sorry, but health is the most important thing.'


    Totti broke his ankle last year and was rushed back for the 2006 World Cup in Germany. He was expected to have to undergo another operation during this close-season to remove a plate put in to help the ankle but doctors said recently it was not needed.


    One of the most gifted players in the world, Totti has never fully achieved his potential at international level despite his World Cup winners' medal.


    The one-club man, idolised by Roma supporters since making his debut aged 16, was arguably in the form of his life last season even with the plate in his ankle.


    He was Serie A's top scorer with 26 goals and earned the European Golden Boot as Roma finished second in the league behind Inter Milan.
     
  14. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    so finally he took a decision.... better late then never :roll:

    i do agree with u Tuta, but if he has to play for italy without motivations, then it's better to call somebody else in his place.

    and afterall he's a phenomenal player when he plays behind the fowards, but if he has to play as a foward, well he's not "unreplaceble" (does this word really exists? :mrgreen:).
     
  15. nt89

    nt89 OUR WORK IS NEVER OVER

    14 February 2005
    L'Aquila (Italy)
    FC Juventus
    phenomenal?? no
    overrated
     
  16. mad87mad

    mad87mad Legend!

    25 December 2006
    what did he do for the national team? except Spitting...
     
  17. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    come on, mate, i know it's tough for a pure juventino to appreciate a romanista, but it's impossible to deny his talent.

    we can agree he never showed on the international stage is true ability, and that's also his fault, probably (which makes him an "underrated player" rather than overrated), but u humiliate your football knowledge, by saying he isn't a fantastic player. his first touch long (and short too) passes are the state of the art.

    i guess also manchester utd fans recognize gerrard's talent, just to make an example :)

    btw, i respect your opinion..... even if i really disagree :)



    many players "underperformed" with our national team shirt..... del piero, mancini, baggio, signori...... but i'm sure nobody would ever deny they were great players ;)

    and talking about last world cup, it was already a miracle he was standing on his foot, if u consider that terrible injury he had.
     
    Last edited: 21 July 2007
  18. mad87mad

    mad87mad Legend!

    25 December 2006
    yes thats true
     
    Last edited: 21 July 2007
  19. gomito#10

    gomito#10 World Cup Winner

    9 May 2003
    DC, USA
    he led the world cup in assists... and they won... he was great
     
  20. PLF

    PLF Legend

    2 August 2004
    Nobody but someone who truly has something 'personal' against Francesco can deny the fact that, he's among the most INCREDIBLY naturally talented players the world has seen in the past decade and maybe throughout the history of the beautiful game.

    Maybe only a few like Zidane and Bergkamp can compete with him for the sorta special and exceptional talent and vision he has in the past decade or so.

    But without making a big post and also saying the things I don't like about Totti and never have, I'm just gonna quickly answer the original topic of the thread.

    Does Italy really need him at this point? No and I don't think he'll be that big of a miss.

    He's always been a fairly selfish guy and care more for himself and Roma than anyone else anyway. And you don't want somebody wearing the national pride (jersey) of millions of Italians in and out of the country who doesn't really consider it that big of an honour anymore nor is motivated enough.

    I'm not disappointed to hear he's not gonna be playing for Italy anymore. He'd never truly shown his talent on the international stage of Non-club football anyway. Though he was unlucky with injuries in that regard.

    Anyway, Italy doesn't have to play with a natural AMF/SS in the side and even if the manager elects to do, there are young talented players in this position as usual and they will need the playing time from now on to develop to something special. If they don't get played now, they never will.

    So, I'm personally, not sad at all to hear that I will not see Totti in the blue Azzuri shirt ever again. Rather excited actually. However, although I don't like the guy much, I will NEVER deny the fact that he is and was just an incredible incredible talent. Not the sorta talent you see every day or every week. Not even every year. More like every 10 years!
     
  21. Robzz

    Robzz Non-League

    16 September 2005
    bye bye totti, we'll be so much better without u, good choice to leave the national :applause:
     
  22. Mana Cerace

    Mana Cerace League 2

    16 February 2006
    Funny to read that as a forward he is just a normal player....he just won the Golden Boot!

    Anyhow, I quote PLF, he is a great player, even underrated in his enormous talent. He sports the good and bad traits of "romanity", this great city, team and community that is controversial and very peculiar in its relationships with roman players. He has his faults, both in this national team issue and all over his career. So does the press and the general prejudice against Roma and romans.
     
  23. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    yep, but he is the leader of a one man attack, with great wings behind him (like mancini and taddei) and with perrotta (what a great advanced midfielder he became!) behind him, so it's quite normal that he scored a lot of goals.
    and he also takes penalty kicks for roma (even if last year he missed a couple of them).

    but anyway, don't misunderstand me mate, i don't wanna underestimate totti, i love him (as a football player... i never liked his attitude).
    i'm just saying that is a shame to see him playing in that position, because when he plays as a foward he can't express is awesome talent.
    we could compare his situation with kaka's situation. kakà and totti ar very different, they have different abilities and different weak points, but both of them are advanced midfielders and both of them waste their talent, playing as fowards (kakà doesn't plays always as a foward, but quite often carletto puts him beside gilardino or ronnie or inzaghi).
    that's really a pity because both of them (for different reasons) should play 20 meters behind the fowards to truly express their abilities.
    but anyway it seems that francesco likes to play as a foward, so there's nothing we can do :roll:


    i agree with u on this, but we also have to say that he often (with his attitude) gave to the italian press good reasons for writing bad things about him :)
     
  24. Mana Cerace

    Mana Cerace League 2

    16 February 2006
    Absolutely, I'd say we are close to 50/50% of responsabilities from both parts :)
     

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