Dark Souls 2

romagnoli said:

Nice. I gave double whips a go - not against enemies, just in Majula. It's pretty absurd.

Are the whips any good by the way? I've never used them, but I like the idea of it, and their initial stats look a lot better than in Demon's/ Dark 1...

Click to expand...

Some people are saying whips are OP actually, especially the Old Whip, which does a ridiculous amount of base damage. The problem is getting one, let alone two, but I'd love to mess around with a dual-whip build, at least as a backup for when I need greater range.

Whips might actually no longer be the most viable for my strategy though, which relies on getting up close and personal, fast and quick, in and out, ninja style. In fact, I just picked up a pair of claws and plan on infusing them with bleed, which I'm hoping will be a fun addition to my build.

I was struggling with my dual-wield swordsman in PvP until yesterday when I went on a tear after dropping my armor down to hardly anything - my rolling ability is now awesome and if I have my timing right, nothing gets to me anymore. I find it so much more interesting, challenging, and exhilarating than playing as a character that just sits behind a massive shield or spams spells.

I'd still like to figure out a way to add greater oomph to my ranged attack, which is solely reliant on the short bow right now. I guess I need to focus on finding a badass bow soon.

drekkard said:

Traditionally this experimentation is done either at the start of the game or in the new game+. The problem is that a t the start of the game you don't have many weapons at all, so I end up specializing in certain weapons, sporadically obtaining a great boss weapon and then discovering things via wiki resources on new game +.

I tried power stance last night and didn't work well at all for my character. You loose any kind of guard and you only have the L2 dual wield attack, right? It spends a lot of stamina and leaves me vulnerable. It may work now and then with small enemies or when I really want to look flashy, but it's a lot less efficient than the shield+sword strategy or even the two hands strategy.

I doubt that I will use it much, unfortunately, but at least I gave a nice flashy show while testing it at Majula in front of all those women NPCs. I hope the ponytail girl took note

Click to expand...

You have L1 attack as well as L2. I actually rarely use L2, as it's so much slower. It's only a finishing move for me, whereas L1 is my go to attack.

You might be right: a power stance dual-wield build might be the least efficient or effective build. It's high risk considering how vulnerable you are, and pretty low reward in terms of damage dealt (from one hit at least).

On the other hand, it might just be that it's the hardest build to play with the highest learning curve, as I've read some people saying they find it very effective. And though it's high risk low reward in terms of single-hit damage, I find it high reward in terms of fun, so obviously it comes down to personal style.

Also, I've come across some guys who wear massive armor so they can take hits, and dual-wield something like greatswords, so with the right timing, they one-hit just about anything. That's an interesting alternative to my light and agile dual-wielder for someone who wishes a bit more protection.

I think it also depends on whether we're talking about PvE or PvP. I think my agile but rather weak build does very well in PvP now, and will only be better the more I learn the timing of other weapons and spells. On the other hand, PvE can be a real bitch at times, like when I first enter new areas, have to deal with multiple dangerous enemies at once, or need to fight a particularly tough boss (like that fucker in the Iron Keep!).

If you do ever wish to try the style I'm doing with a respec or new character, I suggest going all out: pumping adaptability and endurance, and going with as close to 30% equip load or below. It's intimidating 'cause it actually forces you to play the opposite of how we've become used to playing DS - super aggressive rather than sitting behind a shield.

Getting your stats right is essential to that sort of build too. If you have low stamina, you need one hit to count otherwise you're prone to the counter; if you've got low speed you're a sitting duck. If you've got low hitpoints you can't take the one or two knocks you're likely to get and will need to run away mid-battle rather than risk another hit or two and treat the wounds afterwards. So it doesn't seem like something you can just get into from the off - which is where I need to have a bit of a think.

The game is massive, complex and as cryptic as usual. Finished it last night. After building my character wrongly in the first 40 hours, I decided to go for the range strategy (arrows + magic) with the support of a lightning Murakumo, and that worked great and I practically waltzed the last third of the game.

But, you know... "the real fight begins here". Towards new game+.

drekkard said:

The game is massive, complex and as cryptic as usual. Finished it last night. After building my character wrongly in the first 40 hours, I decided to go for the range strategy (arrows + magic) with the support of a lightning Murakumo, and that worked great and I practically waltzed the last third of the game.

But, you know... "the real fight begins here". Towards new game+.

Click to expand...

How'd you build your character wrongly?

I just yesterday finished NG. Yes it is massive and complex, and also very cryptic, which I absolutely loathe about the series. For example, after beating the final level,
I like that Dark Souls has punishingly hard gameplay - I wish more games were like it in that regard - but I really despise how difficult/confusing other aspects of the game are, whether it's by design or not.

Now I have to figure out whether I want to continue on into NG+. For a while now I'd been excited with the thought of it, and had been planning ahead for it, but now that I'm there, my enthusiasm has waned. A lot of it actually is PvP-related - I really thought that by now I'd feel more of a badass in PvP (like I do in PvE) but I'm getting owned pretty badly. I don't even know if I'm winning 25% of my matches, and I feel massively underpowered as an agile dual-wielder going up against high-powered casters and massive-weapon wielders.

So right now I'm just kinda pissed at the game. Maybe I'll go play Infamous instead and then see if my motivation for NG+ returns in the future.

Finally picked this up on Steam today - definitely as tough as advertised. Dealing with multiple foes is an absolute nightmare.

Have started as a Cleric and am making reasonable progress. The whole losing life bar every time you die is ridiculous though - seems a bit overkill to me.

beachryan said:

Finally picked this up on Steam today - definitely as tough as advertised. Dealing with multiple foes is an absolute nightmare.

Have started as a Cleric and am making reasonable progress. The whole losing life bar every time you die is ridiculous though - seems a bit overkill to me.

Click to expand...

There's a ring that limits this life loss when you're a hollow but i don't remember exactly where you get it. You can also help other players as a phantom to recover some humanity.

Honome said:

There's a ring that limits this life loss when you're a hollow but i don't remember exactly where you get it. You can also help other players as a phantom to recover some humanity.

Click to expand...

Nice, thanks for that tip. Managed to find it.

Beat my first boss, felt like running around my house cheering. I guess that's what it does to you.

Proceeded to die about 15 times tryin to kill the 'turtle' type mallet wielders. Good lord they're tough.

beachryan said:

Nice, thanks for that tip. Managed to find it.

Beat my first boss, felt like running around my house cheering. I guess that's what it does to you.

Proceeded to die about 15 times tryin to kill the 'turtle' type mallet wielders. Good lord they're tough.

Click to expand...

Each enemy has its appropiate approach, you will learn as you progress. It's your mind and controlling your impulses what makes you break the game.

By the way, congrats for your first boss kill! It feels absolutely rewarding! Now it's only about 25 more to go!

drekkard said:

Each enemy has its appropiate approach, you will learn as you progress. It's your mind and controlling your impulses what makes you break the game.

By the way, congrats for your first boss kill! It feels absolutely rewarding! Now it's only about 25 more to go!

Click to expand...

Yeah seriously! It's arduous, and I wouldn't call it fun...more compelling.

Think I'm going to have to start using a shield - had been double-wielding maces before. Great against the low level enemies as I can take them out in one stamina bar, but useless against heavier hitters.

beachryan said:

Yeah seriously! It's arduous, and I wouldn't call it fun...more compelling.

Think I'm going to have to start using a shield - had been double-wielding maces before. Great against the low level enemies as I can take them out in one stamina bar, but useless against heavier hitters.

Click to expand...

I also tried dual weapons in the beggining but i just gave up and end up using a shield. Some bosses are just impossible to defeat without a shield and others without magic/arrows. I end up making a warrior/rogue since i used the bow a lot.

That's hilarious. I was about ready to abandon the game because I just wasn't having fun - it was too hard to be enjoyable really. Then discovered part of the reason is because i joined the 'Covenant of Champions' in the first town, having no idea what that meant. Turns out it makes the whole damn thing harder!

Sigh.

I like the series a lot, but some of the things they put in are clearly wrong from a user perspective, even a hardcore one. And what happened to you is one of them.

At least, they should offer a bit more information with important modifiers like this or don't place it just at the start of the game. I think sometimes the world is being cryptic for the sake of it and it's a handicap for the user.

beachryan said:

That's hilarious. I was about ready to abandon the game because I just wasn't having fun - it was too hard to be enjoyable really. Then discovered part of the reason is because i joined the 'Covenant of Champions' in the first town, having no idea what that meant. Turns out it makes the whole damn thing harder!

Sigh.

Click to expand...

That's priceless, I haven't laughed so hard in weeks!

------------

I just got around to get the game and my expectations were unrealistically high. To make a long and detailed list very short, I like the game better than the previous overall which is an achievement in itself by the creators.

- I didn't like the new riposte/backstab system, the old one was better in my opinion (probably because I was a unchallenged master at it).

- I don't like that they made SL1 runs virtually impossible (I was pretty good at that too).

- I don't like the trivialization of death as repairing those rings for 3k is virtually free when you're an hour or two into the game. I discovered two very important rings the first evening playing blind (which I always do).

- I don't particularly like the covenants but I didn't in the previous game either. (*except one)

+ I love the level design as usual, same as the previous ones.

+ I love the simplified equipment upgrade system.

+ I like that there is equipment that looks good "within reason" which is also usable end-game (pvp).

+ I like that bosses are simpler and the overall game is harder (which is my impression so far at least). The Pursuer killed me at the first logical place you encounter him and then I though "screw that for now" and encountered him about an hour later a different place and absolutely painted the floor with him.

+ Seems like powerful equipment is harder to come by early and without complications than the previous game and I like that. The Heide-Sword, which was the second sword I found right next to the first (shortsword) was guarded by a pretty feisty dude who actually owned the sword. I probably should've waited with attacking him but the temptation got the better of me and I got him down slowly but steadily with my fresh-out-of-the-womb character wielding a broken sword... I would never had made it if it weren't for my trusty old dodge routine.

Well, on top of my head that's what I can say for now. I'm playing mostly offline because I can't stand being interrupted while exploring the game "blind". Messages and invaders just distract me from enjoying the game for the first time. I nearly did the same mistake beachryan did, as I heard some rumors that it was the "ultimate PvE Covenant" but I went with the usual "Sunbro" for my pure PvE character. It might end up being my primary all-round character to be honest because it is quite competitive after all with my hybrid faith build (Sun Sword+board and Miracles up the wazoo). Anyway, I went online just to get my 30 medallions to level up the covenant and I packed quite a punch. I play completely differently than I did in PTDE but creative use of resins (which I have farmed for that purpose) and weapon buffs, I can handle myself surprisingly well in a PvP fight. If that's the case, that builds "works" competitively in PvP and PvE to a larger degree than the previous game then it's a huge plus as well.

See you out there in a few weeks and praise the sun!

I finished this a week or two ago on the XB360. Went back to collect all the Achievements and 1000/1000 gamerscore.

Really enjoyable game.

Have people managed to make it through 'alone'? I've not interacted at all with the community yet, but am wondering if to really beat bosses you need to, at least first time play through.

I asked for help to kill 3 bosses that my player class was having extreme problems with. One at the middle of the game and 2 on the final levels.

Though, as you can free roam a bit, sometimes it also depends on when you face those bosses and if you're ready to take them down.

If you ask for help, most probably you will kill the boss at the first attempt or the second one, so use it only as the last resort.

beachryan said:

Have people managed to make it through 'alone'? I've not interacted at all with the community yet, but am wondering if to really beat bosses you need to, at least first time play through.

Click to expand...

I have not killed the final boss yet but other than that I've done everything alone. I have summoned NPC's where available just in case they progress some story or otherwise. I'm still farming and searching for secrets to get even better gear for NG+. I burned a few Bonfire Ascetics in some areas so I expect NG+ to become painfully hard...

At the moment I use this gear:
Alva Armor and leggings +9, Royal Soldier Gauntlets +9 and Standard Helm +9 (both for looks and it suits my weight 49.7%)
Bastard Sword +10 (usually lightning) (Short Sword +9 as backup for the quick thrusts)
Drangleic Shield +4 (A bunch of +9 shields as backup, including a target shield+9 for parrying fun in PvP).
Light Crossbow +9
Several Chimes +9

As you can see I haven't found too many slabs yet but I doubt I'll spend those on armor until I have all the weapons I desire at +10. I have also sacrificed Strenth and Dexterity somewhat to invest heavily into Faith and moderately into End, Vitality, Attunement and Adaptability. I have only 10 Vigor as I block or dodge most attacks also because I couldn't afford to put more points there yet. I started as Cleric (should've picked Knight in retrospect). I do have a few slabs laying around but I haven't decided which gear to upgrade yet.

The standard boss fight strategy is to turtle behind a shield and toss loads of Lightning Spears. I have 52 Faith at the moment so they hit pretty hard. I could use weapon buff and go melee but that might end in death more frequently. I could probably have specialized even more and dropped, for example Adaptability and some Vitality, since I use a shield and have Stamina to back it but I figured it would be boring to not being able to dodge and move effectively. I don't hit extremely hard unless I'm buffed up though, but that's a choice I made.

I pull out the internet cable whenever I want to progress in my own game, when I'm online I'm only helping other players or doing PvP.
--------

After spending some more time with the game I am a little less impressed than I was initially. The level design is NOT as good as the previous game and the bonfires are way too frequent to get the good old "scary" feeling. The opponents are less interesting and their movesets are generally simpler. Most mobs also track the player during animation to a larger extent than previous game, making it more gamey and less "duel-like". This time around the game doesn't punish you much for button mashing your way through enemy lines.

I miss a Balder Knight equivalent, especially the rapier+buckler type. I had some intense fights with those back in the days.

Alas, the game is dumbed down as every other game under the sun but it's still enjoyable at least.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that Emit Force is probably just as insane as Flame Swathe in PvP.

LOL Nashandra wasn't really that hard, I've fought many harder fights during this play-through.

Does NG+ add a lot of stuff that's usual to put into a final build?
Otherwise my toon is basically perfect. All i need is another 50 levels or so which should be pretty quick in NG+. Switched tactic though, using a regular Sun Sword and Resonant Weapon. Thank god for spices...

Just wanted to add to anyone on the fence - this game has its hooks in me now. Despite not liking it much at first and to be honest feeling a bit creeped out for hours after playing it, I'm totally loving it now. The sheer solitude and dread is unparalleled in the open world environment.

Think I'm getting fairly far through it, but would be nowhere without help from other players in boss fights. What a great mechanic. I've joined the sun covenant to try and do my part and give back

Yay, finished! That was a fair slog, what a great game. Highly recommended.

Yeah, it was great. It doesn't linger with me as the first DS game did, I played that one for one and a half year. DSII lost me once I cleared the game, more or less. It's a better game than the previous one in all aspects but the important ones, there it's far worse. I'm talking about the PvE combat ofcourse... enemies in DSII just aren't fun to fight whereas DS nailed that part of the game.

beachryan said:

Yay, finished! That was a fair slog, what a great game. Highly recommended.

Click to expand...

Yup. Brilliant game; was well worth the money paid for it.