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Your worst cpu cheat?

Discussion in 'Winning Eleven' started by plumbers_x, 2 July 2005.

  1. plumbers_x

    plumbers_x Guest

    OK, I've realised for a while that WE8LE is the heaviest in the entire WE/PES series when it comes to cpu cheats, but the worst I've ever seen occurred as follows.

    Playing ML, in the Div 1 Cup, where those that "know" about cpu cheats will recognise that the cheat level always rises during cup competitions. So, of course, my guys were not allowed to shoot on target and the cpu teams is getting 100% of all the breaks, and the referee is penalising me every time I come into contact with a cpu guy....even if it they slide me from behind, free kick to cpu team because I didn't get out of the way of their slide....basically, bullshit super-cheat mode is in full operation.

    So, it's 90 minutes gone, just into injury time and the cpu team have the ball in their half and I'm pressursing the man on the ball. They play a pass back to their keeper and I rush him. His first touch takes the ball right along his goal-line and with the loose ball right in front of the open net, as I get ready to slide in, the keeper boots the ball in an attempted clearance, but it hits his the inside of the post and goes into the net. 1-0 to me.

    But no, corner given....

    Oh well, I guess this game knows no limit as to how far it will go to manufacture a false impression of "challenge".

    I fear for WE9. They have clearly lost the plot when it comes to Ai cheats. Anything goes.


    Anyone come across a worst cheat than that?
     
  2. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    Dont you just hate that the whistle only blows for half time or full time when the ball is in your possession?
     
  3. Tom

    Tom likes turtles Staff

    12 December 2001
    Hamburg
    I'd rather think that's a bug, not a cheat. I've had a similar situation right at the beginning of a game. My keeper did the same and it ended up in a corner for the CPU team :)
     
  4. Mart

    Mart Executive Janitor Staff

    28 February 2002
    NYC
    Darlington FC
    That's a bug that's been in at least since PES. I had a shot that went in right in the top corner but a corner was given, this was against a human player.
     
  5. Han

    Han Very senior member

    22 December 2001
    Holland
    Okay, certainly a bug, but I too believe the CPU has some kind of extra level when there is only five minutes left in a half. He suddenly seems to winning all balls and passes well with high speed in that period. Many times you should be happy if he does not score... Every new version I hope they remove this kind of cheat but sofar it has been there in all versions I played.
     
  6. Chris Davies

    Chris Davies Resident PESsimist Staff

    14 May 2003
    Tranmere Rovers
    A couple of weeks ago, I tried to slide tackle an opponent but he did a quick turn to the left and so I missed him, completely, literally by about five foot. He takes two steps, now even further away from my player, and he goes down like his legs have exploded from underneath him. Red card for me.

    To make matters worse, the referee awarded a penalty; my player was lying on the floor several feet away from the D at the top of the box, and the opposition player fell a couple of feet away from the D.

    I don't mind things like awful offside calls and bad penalty decisions as this is realistic; but when you're sent off for lying on the floor several feet away from someone who then strangely falls over like he's in World War Three...

    Edit: Oh, I almost forgot! I've seen two shots this week that the CPU has scored by the ball A) going through my goalkeeper's HEAD, and B) going through my defender's CHEST. Sometimes I don't see the point in this fucking game.
     
    Last edited: 3 July 2005
  7. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    what about a pass to the keeper by the opponent team. and the keeper grabs for the ball! and the game goes on... no mofu back pass??? happend to me only twice...
     
  8. sitdown30

    sitdown30 Guest

    I've experienced so many of 'em, I couldn't tell which one's the worst.

    But I think the cheating (weird stuffs) is there to create the ups and downs during the season.
    Without those I think The season will be pretty monotonous.

    But some day it could really beat my brain out when I feel like I'm on fire, but the CPU decides that today my team just isn't.


    I know the limitations with PS2, so I guess i'm cool with it.
     
  9. timsmith10000

    timsmith10000 LEICESTER CITY!

    18 August 2003
    Leicester
    ones that are saying they become even better with 5 minutes left.

    This is realistic in many cases, a team that is losing puts every one up and builds up the pressure
     
  10. Not really tim, that happens due to the psychology of football, when you are leading and time is running out you tend to sit back to defend the lead and try and play on the counter, that is due to tactics and psychology not due to the other team magically gaining in strength and speed like what seems to happen in WE/PES - it's that kind of Japanese "Boss level" mentality which still limits the game in certain areas.
     
  11. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    The most harsh decision I've ever had against me was when the CPU had Ronaldo through on goal and I had a defender to his side. I tried to tackle him but instead of him, I fell over and the ref gave ME a red card and them a penalty.
    I mean, I'm on the floor and he's standing, and I get the card? Thats just bullshit.
     
  12. kingpug

    kingpug Guest

    This game cheats so much I cant even play the game without going into a rampage, its everything, the way the ball amazing serves on the line to stay in play, the way you get thrown around the pitch while nothing happens, the way your gk ALWAYS parries the ball into the CPU etc.

    I mean me and my cousin did a KONAMI cup on the PS2, and no joke around 9/10 of our conceeded goals were either lobs over our GK or him parrying it into them, its atrocious. He doesnt parry the ball away and they run and get it, he does it RIGHT into the head or feet of the player, its incredible.

    I also despise the referee decisions, you WALK into them half the time and its a fk?..they throw my players out of the way and nothing? put it this way, almost everytime I see the CPU stumble its a fk. I began a ML with Anderlecht on only 3 stars, and the amount of stumbling I was doing per match almost made me have a heart attack, I have never seen it this bad in all my PES/WE days, it was unbelievable. I only managed 3 games before turning it off.

    But yea, I have played alot of games in my days, but none come even CLOSE to the cheating you suffer in this game, I just dont understand why they need to do it, I have some replays saved and I will maybe upload them later, if I was to save everytime I got cheated I would need gigs of space.

    Anyway, no use me saying anymore when nobody will read, and even more amazingly people still say the game is fair rofl, they obviously dont watch football because if a ref did the same shit in real life that he did in this game, I bet my life he would get killed.
     
  13. Me!TheRaven

    Me!TheRaven League 2

    28 April 2004
    Portugal
    I totally feel you brother!It really gets to one´s nerves...
     
  14. Zygalski

    Zygalski Ninja Samurai

    2 February 2003
    London, UK
    England
    Too true!

    It's quite bad. I'm glad I don't play against the CPU any more.... these days I just shout at my defenders for stepping out of the way of my opponents strikers..... :applause:
     
  15. anurein

    anurein Non-League

    11 August 2002
    I agree with you guys, the AI cheats in every game against me, I play on levels 5 and 6. I feel I can always have more possession than the CPU even if I choose a really crap team to play against Real or AC.

    I dont know why the CPU have to resort to cheating to score, they can never out play me. I havent started ML yet, I fear that constant CPU cheating will put me off this game completely.
     
  16. Derfil

    Derfil Big Boss

    6 July 2004
    Here
    A.C. Milan
    It really cheats, but can't remember only one :
    0-0 till the 90th minute then the ref blown a wistel for a PK, and I don't know why !!!!!!
     
  17. anurein

    anurein Non-League

    11 August 2002
    How about this one ? the ref blows for full time right after Kick-Off, just after the CPU or your mate has scored an injury time winner.
     
  18. kingpug

    kingpug Guest

    I once had the CPU put my own player in front of me stopping me getting to the ball, I couldnt move that player and no surprise the CPU won the ball, load of shit, I have it saved if nobody believes me.

    Ah fuck it, I cant compress, DivX6 doesnt work and the rest are shit, I had some good ones aswell :shock:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 4 July 2005
  19. Mart

    Mart Executive Janitor Staff

    28 February 2002
    NYC
    Darlington FC
    The only thing I'll concede out of everything listed as being CPU bias is what Han and fanboyeater have said. There is that element to the game that causes frustration and something that should definitely be worked on.

    Everyone else is listing bugs that occur in multiplayer/single/no player.

    Balls clipping through players happens all the time, like they could program special clipping only for human player's teams?

    Really dodgy decisions, meh, heard it all before seen it happen many a time and *shock* sometimes the humans get the decisions too.

    The whistle tends to blow for time at a change of possession, when the defending team touches it or clears it - generally this would be the team hanging on, which is invariably the human player for the reason already discussed.

    Backpasses are always kicked by the keeper unless they're not actual passes, defenders run into it all the time and can even appear to kick it back to a keeper but unless it's a genuine pass the game won't register it as such. Again, happens for/against human teams.

    Your own players getting in the way, annoying but I've seen it happen a lot with AI controlled players. An issue that needs fixing but not a cheat.
     
  20. JimJoeC

    JimJoeC Custom User Title

    26 June 2002
    Southampton, England
    Saints
    I have to disagree Mart, the com DOES cheat.

    The amount of times I've gone up for a headerand been frozen in place whilst the cpu prances off and picks up the ball then my player is 'released' and I can attempt to make a tackle.

    Also the end of halfs are fucking idiotic, you have the ball the whistle blows at the appointed time (normaly when you are on the attack) the com has the ball and it seems to get some Alex Ferguson style added time. Until you get control of the ball that is then the ref blows the whistle for the end of the game!

    I never see this in two player and I play a LOT of two player.

    Also you have to make three to four challenges until you get the ball whereas the com will make one tackle, foul, blatant shove and waltz off with the ball.

    The cheating is most prevalent when you are away, the ref will watch you get battered by the com and just carry on, the first tackle you make you get booked!

    The com cheats it's arse off. I actually enjoy getting beaten by the com on the rare occasion it strings together some good moves and scores decent goals.

    Sadly this happens all too rarely.
     
  21. Mart

    Mart Executive Janitor Staff

    28 February 2002
    NYC
    Darlington FC
    Right, someone ban this man. ;)

    I'm not saying there's no bias but I still don't see the stuff mentioned happening specifically in CPU vs Human matches. I multiplayer my tits off at work (1v1, 2v2, 3v2, 2vCPU etc.) as well as play single player a lot and that's what I'm going by.

    I'm also a stubborn bastard so no one will convince me unless I see it myself.
     
  22. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    The cheats in this saga are ruining the fan of single player. I won't buy any other WE. I will play multiplayer with my friends and maybe try the PC version. But there's no sense in expanding the Master League if this kind of cheats are in it. Because it's not fun, it's not realistic and it's stupid.

    List of standard cheats DONE only by COM (assuming the COM plays the worst team and you play the best one):
    - Ball deflections go 90% of times directly to COM player.
    - Headers won when necessary, no matter what you do or the player you control. If the COM controls Saviola, Saviola will head and score against Stam and Nesta.
    - No low stamina. In fact, the more minutes, the more powerful stats for the COM players. The last 5 minutes of each half are "hell time" no matter what you do.
    - General stats unrealistic. The COM players can do U-turns faster than Henry or run faster than him or react faster than him.
    - Stealing the ball to a COM player is more difficult than stealing it to a human oppponent, specially when the COM runs straight and you just can't rob the ball with 3 defenders hanging from his neck.
    - Extra minutes longer when the COM is in position.
    - Special referee favourishing decisions towards the COM players.

    And now, the WORST:
    - When you score your 2nd goal, your team becomes idiotic.
    - General passing and shooting accuracy decreased when necessary when COM is losing. General stats decreased or faked during the match to preserve narrow results.
    - Your own players have no balance. When you collide with an opponent, YOU will fall, no matter what. Saviola will push down Stam.
    - The ball magically speeds up and dow in order to let the COM win the ball.
    - When you take a corner, the COM clears by heading almost to the midfield, where a lonely COM player always receives the ball. No human can do that header clearing.
    - You goalkeeper won't block any ball in the last 5 minutes of each half. In fact, if you're winning, you're keeper is keen on letting pass any ball in or fall on his own ass insted of jumping to the side.

    There's more, of course. All in all, it's 3 years we're seeing that same cheats exactly in the game. If they can't do the game without cheats, at least change the type of cheats, for god's sake! We're bored of it.
     
  23. plumbers_x

    plumbers_x Guest

    Yeah, i recognise all of these things you list, drekkard.

    What i would say about certain ones (like cpu players are more agile, etc) - i actually think this is just about acceptable. To me, because AI is still nowehere near advanced enough to compete with a human brain, this is the game giving the "stupid" cpu players a slight edge to try to balance that, albeit that it sometimes goes way over the top with the cpu speed boosts, etc.

    The super-boost the cpu team gets before the end of each half gets a bit tiresome. It really pisses me off with the cpu team actually gets the very opposite of fatigue!! They also suddenly develop completely improbable passing speed and accuracy during this period, get every break or deflection, the ref suddenly decides to ignore all thier fouls and penalise you for nothing. Konami really need to tone this down as it can basically wreck the fun in an otherwise enjoyable tactical battle. I just hate the way they overdo the cpu boost and cheating during this phase of play.

    You also mention that your guys suddenly become worse after they score and the cpu needs to chase the game. This is true, but also true if the cpu scores first. Basically, the game tends to play fine until someone scrores and Koanmi have decided that if teh cpu goes 1-0 up, it will cheat a bit to keep the lead. If it goes 1-0 down, it will cheat a bit to get back level. When the scores are level again, it tends to settle back down. I guess they are trying to simulate the changes in psychology that occur when one team is losing and one winning, but that doesn't stop it being incredibly annoying.

    The ones I find most annoying are where you don;t actually have proper control of your player (even using the unreliable super-cancel)....the ones where you can see you player slow down when chasing a loose ball, just to make sure the cpu guy gets their first, the ones where he just won't move at all but adopts the ape posture, the ones where he actually changes direction and goes into that weird zig-zag run for a few strides to stop you getting to the ball, or those woeful limp passes that still crop up or passes which go nothing like the direction you aimed but remarkably go straight to a cpu guy. I find completely unacceptable anything which stops me having full control of the one player I'm supposed to be controlling and ignores the commands I issue. When that happens, it can no longer be described as gameplay. At times, the game teeters on the edge of being complete and utter bollocks.
     
  24. Dar

    Dar Fullonrapist Staff

    21 February 2003
    Dublin
    Yet you continue to play the game continuously anyway....

    8)
     
  25. JimJoeC

    JimJoeC Custom User Title

    26 June 2002
    Southampton, England
    Saints
    Whilst I agree with the vast majority of this paragraph there is one thing I have to disagree with.

    The loose passes you mention happen to the cpu and, of course, happen in real life too so I think this is not so much of a cheat but more realistic.

    However, it does make a difference when it happens four or five times in a row.

    Konami need to sort this out and I can't beleive that it's an AI issue as how difficult is it to pass, pass, pass shoot, goal?

    I enjoy getting beat when the com does it with style. It's STILL fun!
     
  26. mattster12

    mattster12 All-round Bastard

    11 April 2005
    This thread should be called "the biggest sore losers, whingers thread" God what you've all posted are complete lies lol. Honestly just show us proof, but no your all like "I've got loads of video's.......honest......but there the only video's in the world that can't be uploaded" lol. C'mon all this cheating stuff is just made up! I mean the cpu doesn't always get better in the last 5mins lol This is when I score most of my goals :lol:

    The whistle doesn't always blow when I have the ball at the end of the half. This is just a bare faced lie! The cpu cannot score every game, if it could I wouldn't be able to go through a whole season undefeated would I? I always have control of my player cos super cancel DOES work. As for all this stumbling shit, I do it to the cpu all the time!!!

    The goalkeepers do exactly the same thing for the cpu, in that they will parry it to my CF if I shoot across the GK. It doesn't happen everytime or only in the last 5 mins. Also what's this rubbish about the cpu heading corners into midfield and the cpu always getting it, WTF! I've scored so many goals cos the cpu doesn't clear it properly.

    You should practice corners more if you cant win headers. I don't suppose any of you notice that the cpu will take more short goal kicks near the end of the game. There just inviting you to score!! I've tried to see some of these things but I can't, cos they don't happen. I could go on and on and tell you how each point being made is rubbish. Some of you even contadict each other lol. Some people say it's only in ML, some say it's only when they play cpu and others say it happen in multiplayer.

    I mean come on you can say whatever you want but until ONE of you show some proof your all just a bunch of whinging liars lol. So show me some proof!! I'm going to see if I can borrow a dvd recorder off one of my mates and upload some FULL games. So I can prove to you all that it doesn't cheat and I can do exactly the same things to the cpu. Then finally we can end these stupid arguments about soemthing that doesn't happen.

    Everyone can have an opinion......but if it contradicts FACT!! IT's called a LIE!
     
  27. plumbers_x

    plumbers_x Guest

    I would agree if the loose/limp passes reflected something plausible. Indeed, I think that passing is generally too accurate in the game. It's one of the areas which still looks scripted. Just vaguley aim, click the button and it goes straight to the man.

    The problem is that you can play pinpoint perfect firm passes all the way up the pitch until you get to the opposition box. Then, when you try to play a simple 10 yard pass to a striker in space right in froint of goal, the stupid dribbly pass or completely wrong direction pass emerges. Is this because the guy passing has vastly lower passing speed/accuracy stats than your other players? No...it's a context sensitive pass...it's the final pass to finish off a move...we can't have you scoring too many goals so the simple solution is to make the final pass in the box malfunction very frequently.

    The same happens with through balls, where you see the killer ball is clearly on to a stiker breaking to one side, you aim and then press the through ball button and it inexplicably goes to the other side of the pitch, removing all possible danger.....it's like, wtf was that all about?

    But when the cpu is in it's super-boost mode, general passing does suddenly become pathetic, and no passing essentially becomes unviable as it just goes straight to cpu guys.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 5 July 2005
  28. plumbers_x

    plumbers_x Guest

    I didn't bother to read any further in your post as you are clearly somewhat "lacking". Why are you posting in this thread when you have no idea what we are talking about?
     
  29. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Yes, of course I'm playing. I'm addicted to football! But 2 years ago I played a lot the master league. Last year I began to get bored with the cheats in single player. This year I've been playing online in the PC all year, forgetting master league.

    And next year I wont even bother on buying the ps2 version. I'll wait to the pc version to have proper (fingers crossed) online playing. But it's the last time I've paid for single player.
     
  30. ClassicD

    ClassicD Galáctico

    11 November 2001
    Glasgow
    Celtic
    Mattster, I have some small movies of what you claim not to exist. Granted, none are from WE8LE but from earlier versions, but that's irrelevant considering what you are saying.

    If anyone can point me to where I can upload these I will gladly do so (waiting on my HD right now, before you call me a "liar").

    P.S. vid sizes are 6.4, 7.2 & 1.4mb respectively.
     

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