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The estranged Chelsea fan thread

Discussion in 'Football' started by Professor Nutmeg, 25 September 2007.

  1. Professor Nutmeg

    Professor Nutmeg ML Fanatic

    3 July 2002
    Master League
    Am i alone here? ](*,) :l

    Abramovich, Grant, Kenyon, Arnesen, De Visser, Buck, they can all go to hell, quite frankly. A once up and coming club, through its own on-field merits, has been ruined, in my eyes.
     
    Last edited: 25 September 2007
  2. Clockender

    Clockender is back...but for how long?

    27 November 2001
    East Lower, Block 13
    Arsenal FC
    I think you will find many fans who share your opinion, me included !;)
     
  3. Professor Nutmeg

    Professor Nutmeg ML Fanatic

    3 July 2002
    Master League
    With any luck, they'll find themselves in the Coca Cola League where they can Get Real!
     
  4. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    Well Prof, I actually think that José had to go. Over time, I'm sure he'll learn from his mistakes but I think what we had was a great 'impact' manager. The first year we were superb, the second year we slipped a little but no other team was on their game, the third year we looked jaded and ponderous and this year, more of the same. He didn't look like he had any more ideas to give us, and over this period of time we lost some real world class players simply because they didn't get on with him. Consequently, we now have a squad that is inferior to the one he inherited - basically reliant on two men.

    The whole situation was handled badly (as ever with Chelsea!) but I think the decision was the right one. We were going to get panned by the press no matter what we did, so it's no surprise to see them sharpening their knives now. I actually feel sorry for Grant - he certainly doesn't strike me as the Machiavellian character that is being portrayed, unless Machiavelli wandered about with a complete look of shock on his face.

    He won't be there for long - I firmly believe Roman has his eyes on the long term and has the right man lined up. We'll be back on track eventually, we're in for at least a year of restructuring, but we'll come out in much better shape.

    But hey - I've been wrong before! ;)
     
  5. vanzandt

    vanzandt The answer must be Jam

    26 July 2007
    Everton
    To show you the complete lack of understanding Roman has for the game he has already talked to Sven and Hiddink...

    Both can be effective club managers...but do either strike you as playing non defensive expansive attacking football?

    Both these guys can be ultra defensive at times, especially if trying to preserve a lead.

    Roman is acting like Chelsea is his plaything.

    Roman takes a very literal interpretation when it comes to owning the club, he treats it like he ownes it and the fans do not.

    Wrrrrong!!!!

    Fans always own the club no matter what is written in the deeds, when owners gets that wrong and screw that up, they can sometimes find that there is no club left worth owning.

    Roman has got away with a lot because of his prior investment, but a lot of fans are disgusted with his moves and the majority will not give him the fee ride he once enjoyed.

    If he was to do this again with a manager loved by the fans, then the fan base will turn on him and then it is good night Vienna.
     
  6. PetrovLFC

    PetrovLFC Raul!

    13 March 2005
    NW London
    Liverpool
    Excatly what I was think re Erickson and Hiddink. They will hardly set the world on fire.

    Van Bastern is a better bet, but I still don't rate him either. He was sat just behind Roman at Old Trafford the other day.

    Chelsea won't be ruined until Abramovich gets bored and packs his suitcase.
     
  7. Ret KiT

    Ret KiT Premiership

    25 March 2007
    chelsea with all the money in the world can buy whatever players but can't get a proper manager after mourinho , now thats a shame.
     
    Last edited: 26 September 2007
  8. matherto

    matherto 12 Times

    13 October 2004
    St. Helens, Merseyside.
    Manchester United
    Typical isn't it, as soon as Chelsea start faltering, all the ex-United/Liverpool fans come flooding back (not saying you're an ex-whatever fan mate, just seems the general attitude)
     
  9. vanzandt

    vanzandt The answer must be Jam

    26 July 2007
    Everton
    If you are going to slag someone off (whoever that maybe be) for something said then have the courtesy to properly detail what your complaint actually is.
     
  10. Professor Nutmeg

    Professor Nutmeg ML Fanatic

    3 July 2002
    Master League
    Hope you're not referring to me ;) I lived in Chelsea for over 2 decades, why the hell would i support Liverpool/Man Utd.

    I don't think some of you are getting where i'm coming from though.

    Hi TB, long time no see, i thought this might lure you out ;) I agree with the JM argument to an extent. I believe he is still relatively inexperienced, if you like and his tenure at CFC will have taught him a few things, even if he lets on that he knows everything. He'll be more wary/versatile now.
     
    Last edited: 26 September 2007
  11. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    Natch. ;)

    To be honest, what I've seen Roman do for the club over the last few years - and I mean the behind the scenes stuff, the years of work he has put into the youth set up and the training ground - he is not the Russian egomaniac that the press like to portray. You never hear him in the press, he is not a man who likes to be noticed. His only concern is to have a football club that he can be proud of, and Mourinho was taking it in the wrong direction. I'd say about 40% of Chelsea supporters felt the same way (myself included). The only shock is that it happened now rather than at the end of the season. (It might have been 99% support by then, the way we were going!)

    We don't know what happened 7 days ago, we don't know what happened in the last year and a half. No one outside of that circle can say for definite what happened, all we ever read is the crap that is spouted in the press. The decision to leave may have been Roman's, it may have been mutual but it is just as likely that José got the hump and jacked it in.

    It's not been handled well, but I'm not sure there is anyway to come out of a situation like this smelling of roses. As for the people you mention above, I'm not sure how worthy they are of your hatred when Mourinho gets away scot free - he is not an innocent victim.

    We've had much darker days than this in the last 25 years and now we have to pick ourselves up and start again. It'll be fun, I promise! \\:o/
     
  12. Metallica

    Metallica Whoosh... Bullshit!

    20 August 2003
    Pissed up in Sam Platt's
    I dont know if this has happend or not but I wouldnt be suprised if a group of Chelsea fans formed a team just like a group of Man Utd fans formed FCUM which was made because of the Glazers taking over
     
  13. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    An important italian football journalist, asked about van basten's qualities as a coach...


    "Van basten was a great player"

    "yes, i see, but i asked what u think about him as a coach"

    3 seconds silence, then "van basten was really a great player"

    :lol:

    i really feel for chelsea fans. such a stupid move, such a bad timing :(
     
  14. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    There is talk of it - it's all the rage now. And let's face it, I bet FC United supporters have a lot more fun on matchday than any Premiership club supporters do.
     
  15. steevio_uk

    steevio_uk Premiership

    7 October 2003
    West Ham
    Chelsea have always been of same size and stature as us lot until the mid to late nineties, but you always shared many things in common and you had a proper club which I an many others had a mutual and begrudging respect for despite our massive rivalry.
    What is left is just a soulless company with happy customers but estranged fans. I think until the Russian sets sail, you will never have your club back.

    I know plenty of Chelsea fans that are just sick of it all now, being priced out of games and the games they do get to they are sitting next to day tripper supporters who barely know the words to 'care free' or know or care who John Bumstead or Erland Johnsen are.

    I am sitting here hoping we don't go the same way...
     
    Last edited: 26 September 2007
  16. Nick Cave

    Nick Cave Wrexham fan for my sins...

    10 July 2004
    Non football league waste land...
    Wrexham AFC
    He was a great player but in the past it does not always equate to great managers, they do need a Big name or reputation I feel to bring the players back on board, the one thing "the special one" had was the players respect, and when your managing a bunch of multi millionaire's, you're going to struggle without it, no mater who you are....
     
  17. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Good thread...
    Quite a lot of Chelsea fans will be waking up now.
    I've always liked Chelsea (even when in lower divisions), but still it is a good thing for football that Chelsea never proved to be the all-conquering team. It proves (for the moment) that you can't buy everything...this will stop quite a few sharks (but not all).
    Still Mourinho's Chelsea had enormous merits. Personally i rate two consecutive Premiership titles higher than a CL' win...Winning a strong league is all about consistency...you can win a cup with luck, but you can never win a league with luck...whoever wins a league, always deserves it. The consistency, the grinta and the will power are enormous merits to me...In a way Chelsea is like the big German national teams, they were never liked but they always were the best.
    Now about Roman. I'm not sure i agree with TB-friend (long time no see indeed). I'm sure he did not bought Chelsea to be some sort of star (to be in the limelight???is that correct English). I'm not sure that he is a real football freak. I'm still not convinced that Chelsea is not a tool to launder dirty money...although nothing is proven about that...but there are strong indications that Abromovich is at least a maverick business man.
    Sooner or later Abramovich will have enough of Chelsea and that's when the club will be in big trouble.
    About the troubles now, to me Mourinho is a fanttastic coach (but who am i to say this), Mourinho's departure is Chelsea's loss...but on the other hand this set back makes Chelsea more likeable to me...

    About Van Basten: he was indeed a great player...

    Personally the thing i would most love the see is that Martin Jol leaves Spurs for Chelsea and Mourinho comes at Spurs...would be a good thing for everybody...Jol is a great manager who does not deserve the stick he's getting. Chelsea would have the second best coach in the world (i know i exagerate). Mourinho could take his English revenge and Spurs would have the best coach in the world...And i would be happy too because maybe that way Spurs could have a chance to beat Arsenal (again?????)
     
    Last edited: 26 September 2007
  18. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    I don't want to hurt genuine fans' feelings but to me all the big clubs are soulless companies with happy customers but estranged fans...maybe Barcelona (until this season????) and Liverpool are the only exceptions.

    I used to be an enormous Man Utd fan and it is precisely for this reason that i don't like them anymore (to prevent another useless discussion on this subject, this is a wholy personal and subjective feeling that is relevant to me, but has no relevance in general...i've never claimed to be logical in that change of mind. It's something that i somehow "sensed" but cannot explain).
     
  19. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    exactly. by repeating "he was a great player" he meant to say that he doesn't consider van basten a good coach.:mrgreen:
     
  20. steevio_uk

    steevio_uk Premiership

    7 October 2003
    West Ham
    Even Man Utd have a good element of a decent fan base which is very evident at away games. They are always superb at Upton Park, whereas even the Chelsea away fans have been diabolical the past 2 seasons.
    (Everyone knows that it's the away fans that really contain the more ardent of supporters).
    Chelsea and Arsenal are the worst, for sure. I think it massively comes down to the sciety in said areas; middle class wine sippers who are looking to get into 'footie', whereas despite their success you will always have a strong core of working class folk in and around Manchester and Liverpool following their respected clubs.
    One of the biggest fallacies in supporters folklore is that 'more proper mancunians in Manchester support City', which is both fond thought and complete nonsense in my opinion.

    I can feel it creeping into Upton Park already, booing your own players, leaving before the final whistle, fickle fans.. it's bollocks which is why away days are a million miles better than home games.
    I am just concerned about the day we move into our new 60,000 stadium a mile from the Olympics site with the regeneration of the area and the new brand of clientelle in the area... I hope that isn't the day which is our turn to effectively die as a proper football club.

    Fuck the success, fuck the money and the big players.... it's about the team and it's about the experience with your fellow fans and the banter.
    Something that seems to now be long gone at Stamford Bridge and shows no sign of returning while the Russian is at the helm.
     
  21. Professor Nutmeg

    Professor Nutmeg ML Fanatic

    3 July 2002
    Master League
    Nice to see we can all have a reasonable discussion in here :)

    The thing is, i'm sure if RA were to leave, there would be another investor in, before the door had even shut, so i don't think they'll be a problem financially. Possibly, but not neccessarily. It seems to be de rigeur these days to buy/own a club if you have the cash. My huge problem is this 'brand' thing, it really annoys me.

    Oh and on starting a new club, bagsy a midfield spot :thumbup:
     
  22. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    I disagree with some of the points above but it's not really worth going into - The fact is, we don't know much about Roman. From what I've read, his relationship with Yeltsin meant that when Russia's industries were privatised, he was able to buy a nationalised industry on the cheap (no doubt with a significant 'finders fee' going to Yeltsin). Crooked certainly, but not actually illegal. It's not a million miles from what happened here in the 80's (and still goes on thanks to Mr Blair), but with much less at stake. But at the end of the day, it comes down to someone's opinions versus someone elses and is not worth going over and over (again!). Besides, he's an improvement on Bates!

    The Van Basten rumour I don't think is worth going into as the only foundation is that he was sat 1 row behind Roman at Old Trafford. Even for the press that's a bit of a stretch!

    Steevio - be prepared because it's coming! It is what the Premiership is now. It creates and it feeds on hype, and that's what draws in tourists and the day trippers. The only way to avoid it is to stay crap, which I'm sure you're not about to do.

    And as you mention Johnny Bum, I met him last year at an event and he was a wonderful bloke. Had plenty of time to chat to fans and tells stories about the old days. Drives a cab now - can you see Frank Lampard doing that in the years to come!!??

    But I will revert back to my original point - Mourinho, great coach though he was, had run out of ideas and could not take the club forward and I think in the long run, it was the right decision that he should leave.
     
  23. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    I've got pull you up on a few things there, Steevio. First and foremost, most of the singing you could hear at Old Trafford on Sunday was the Chelsea fans, despite being stuck up in the Gods and away from the microphones.

    Secondly Anfield is like a morgue any week that they aren't winning 6-0 or playing us in a Chapions League semi. And didn't I distinctly hear the Liverpool players getting booed off on Saturday??? Walking away from Anfield is like being in the centre of Oslo some weeks. Barely a scouse voice to be heard.

    I won't deny that we have been lame at Upton Park because you're an 'ear witness', nor try and let on that Stamford Bridge is a wall of noise, but I think some of your generalisations are way off.

    Same for Barca, Gerd. You don't hear a peep from them until they're winning.

    The fact is, big clubs attract glory supporters who for the most part sit in silence, waiting to be entertained. That's life.
     
  24. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    I'm sure there would be a few takers too, Prof. Berezovsky, Eddie Jordan and a mysterious US investor were all sniffing about at the time. But with all the work Roman has done behind the scenes, it is bizarre to think that he would just sell up.

    But yes, the brand issue always makes my skin crawl. Every club tries to encourage the 'brand' but it's only us that make it so cringingly obvious!
     
  25. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    Does Vannizzle still post here? - he'd love a piece of this!
     
  26. steevio_uk

    steevio_uk Premiership

    7 October 2003
    West Ham
    I wasn't meaning to sound as though Chelsea are just completely dead as fans nowadays and that Liverpool are totally vocal, just more that compared to what Chelsea used to be like and compared to what Man Utd's away support is like, they are really a lot quieter.
    I guess I don't really know what sort of percentage 'proper fans' go to Liverpool matches compared to Chelsea, but i'd wager it was significantly higher at Anfield.

    Obviously there will be games where even the most quiet fans will be loud such as some of the home CL games at Stamford Bridge and indeed at certain away games, but years ago, going to Upton Park was one of the top days for a Chelsea fan, now for the new fashionable fan it isn't worth shit unless it's Man Utd, Arsenal or a big Champions League team.
    Liverpool, alongside Newcastle, have some of the most overrated support in the business but they always make a good deal more noise than Chelsea do, both home and away.

    Mate, as I say I am fearful and prepared for such bollocks to happen to us and it is just a massive shame. I cannot say what I will do or what will happen as I am not in that position yet.
    Just hope it isn't for a while yet...
     
  27. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    At least you're going into it with your eyes wide open - my advice is to enjoy the rise to the top and stay away from the tabloids and crap like SkySports news. The atmosphere will change, and you will really miss the old days but that's unavoidable. The key to remember is that at the end of the day, it's only football - not the life and death struggle that Sky would have you believe.

    Although, having seen your performance on Sunday, you don't have to worry about this for some time yet! ;)
     
  28. steevio_uk

    steevio_uk Premiership

    7 October 2003
    West Ham
    :lol:

    To be fair, we weren't too bad at St James'... just shocking at the back!

    Believe me, after last season there is all but a few papers I'd care to wipe my arse with and SSN is just laughable at the best of times anyway!

    I think a slow progress is a good thing, the route of Everton and Spurs. Build and consolidate and make that move when the time is right.
    Spurs should have done it this year but I fear they have missed the boat. To finish 5th 2 years running and to not get the right players in to make that step up is criminal.
    They should have gone for a near world class midfielder this last window and could have done without spunking that money on Bent.
     
  29. T Butcher fan

    T Butcher fan Champions League

    3 December 2001
    I agree entirely - I really wish we had moved much slower. I'm not sure what the rationale was for moving so quickly (probably this fecking 'brand' issue once again #-o) but there's nothing that will put people's backs out in this country more than someone who is flash with the cash.

    Having said that, we were everyone's second team for a year - then we started winning trophies. That really pissed people off!
     
  30. Professor Nutmeg

    Professor Nutmeg ML Fanatic

    3 July 2002
    Master League
    Tell you what though. In the meantime, if Chelsea could start playing attractive football, that might be appreciated. The suits unfortunately look to remain a bunch of arses, but let's at least see some decent play. I would be interested to see the likes of Malouda, Cole, Essien, SWP, Drogba, Pizarro etc under the influence of a short-passing, attack-minded coach. Surely it would make for a great spectacle. Give me Keegan's 'one more goal' philosophy any day :mryellow:

    New coach with a clue required, however...
     
    Last edited: 26 September 2007

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