The Cycling Thread

Discussion in 'Other Sports' started by Ronaldinho_23, 24 July 2010.

  1. Ronaldinho_23

    Ronaldinho_23 Premiership

    11 February 2007
    Spain
    Fc. Barcelona , Juventus
    and the winner is ALBERTO CONTADOR

    spanish's sport...are the best
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 9 May 2011
  2. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Yeah, the guy who attacked when Andy Schleck had a mechanical problem in the mountain, very fair Alberto Contador. :TTTH:

    Anyway, some day Andy is gonna win le Tour I believe, he just needs to improve is trial time skills. We will see the batle between Andy and Contador for almost a decade. Cycling is getting more and more interesting, I must say is probably my second favourite sport (I don't say it's Basketball because I only like the NBA). :P

    Spanish sport is in a great moment, the superpower in world's sport. Spain done a magnificient job since Barcelona '92. Well done. :TU:
     
  3. Ronaldinho_23

    Ronaldinho_23 Premiership

    11 February 2007
    Spain
    Fc. Barcelona , Juventus
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    sheleck and her brother


    amstrong...
    YouTube - Tour de France 2003 - Stage 9
     
  4. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    In my setence you should underline the word "attacked". The cases you're talking about, no one have attacked when rivals had fallen. Alberto Contador deliberately attacked when Andy had the problem, which is unfair. I not saying he should have waited Andy, he just should not have attacked the yellow jersey at that precise moment. But ok, is just my own opinion.
     
  5. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Special one, you don't have a clue about cycling.
    Andy Schleck made a mistake, so his chain got stuck.
    Even Schleck's dad, a former professional cyclist, said that Contador was not to blame and that Andy made a mistake.
    It's very unfortunate for Andy who will loose the Tour with 39 seconds difference. That is exactly the time he lost with the chain incident in the stage to Luchon.
    I would have like Schleck to win, but people forget the stage to Liège where Cancellara let the bunch wait for a fallen Schelck who was 4 minutes behind.
    Cyclism has other fair play rules than sports like football. Cancellara got lots of criticism from insiders. In cyclism one never waits for rivals.
     
  6. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    What does perceive or not about cycling have to do with one's own opinion. Gerd, I follow cycling since I was a little boy. I grew up watching the likes of Jan Ulrich, Marco Pantani, Jalabert, Virenque and the prime of Lance Armstrong and I watch every race of cycling (not only the 3 big tours but also Paris-Roubaix, Dauphiné, Tirreno Adriactico, etc) so I don't admit you say I "don't have a clue about cycling".

    I know Andy did a mistake when changing gear (very commum mistake in Joaquim Agostinho, do you know him?) but it was a shame that a guy like Contador (who is the best rider, imo) to attack in that precise moment. At the end he was even worse having lied to the journalist saying he hadn't seen Andy stop. Read what Lance said about the incident.

    I'm not blaming Alberto for not wait Andy. I'm blaming him to choose that exactly moment to attack the yellow jersey. It's a different thing if you understand me.

    And yes, I'm with Hushovd and the others who criticized Cancellara in Liege stage.
     
  7. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Ok i'm sorry, i shouldn't have said that you haven't got a clue.
    Let me rephrase: you come from a culture that is rather foreign to cuclism's way of thinking.
    I can assure you that 90% of the cyclist community laughs about all the fuzz surrounding the chain incident.
    When even Johnny Schleck (Andy's father, who used to be a teammate of Joaquin Agostinho) says Andy made a mistake and Contador is not to blame, i gues this says it all.

    Personally i prefer Schleck to Contador. But i think in this instance you can't blame Contador. Armstrongs's comment is logic because he does not like Contador (cfr. the rivalry in last year's Tour de France).

    I watch cycling for more than 40 year and saw Agostinho cycling (as a matter of fact, my all-time favourite and youth idol Van Impe had to beat Agostinho to win his first stage in the Tour, that was in Orcieres Merlette in 1972).
     
  8. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    I'm sorry too gerd, I was a bit rude in my repost, my apologies. ;)

    Yeah we both share that preference on Andy. Despite all the fuzz about the incident we all knew that Contador was going to win the Tour, those 31 seconds before the stage 15 would vanish in the time trial. In mountains they were equal. Andy needs to train the aerodinamical feature a bit more (I know is difficult because he's tall) in order to fight against properly against the Astana cyclist.

    Interesting fact on Van Impe and Agostinho. I read and saw many things about Agostinho but didn't know that history. Van Impe was a great climber winning several times the maillot à pois rouges I guess. I thought all belgians would nominate Eddy Merckx as favourite cyclist. :P

    Finally I found someone on this forum who likes cycling. :))

    Tour of France classifications
    Yellow jersey: Alberto Contador - third victory for the spanish. Congrats Alberto
    Points classification: Alessandro Petacchi - A deserved prize for the 36 years old italian rider
    Mountains classification: Anthony Charteau - Well, the organization needs to rethink some classification aspects
    Young rider classification: Andy Schleck - Absolutely stunning
    Team classification: RadioShack - they disappoint in indivual terms but won collectively
    Combativity award: Sylvain Chavanel - I would prefer Vino but Sylvain seems ok too
     
  9. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    No problem my friend, i deserved that.
     
  10. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    I was 7 years old when Merckx won his first Tour. According to my parents i cried every time Merckx won...as a child i hated him.
    Years later when i graduated from school, we played a football match against an all-star team. I was LMF and the RMF of the other team was...Eddy Merckx. He is a born winner and was very physical during the match. After the match he came to me shook hands and asked me to have a drink. He turned out to be a very, very nice person. I spent an unforgettable evening with him. And then i told him the story that as a kid i always cried when he won because i hated him. He laughed about it and said that i must have been a real pain in the ass for my parents because he said he won all the time... Since then i have a very big fondness for the person Eddy Merckx. He is a very humble and very sociable guy.
     
  11. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Yep, I love cycling too, a lot! I watch the big 3 every year (if possible) since... always??

    My favorite cyclist was Pedro Delgado, that won a Tour and lost 2 because he was a total disaster and forgot things. He even arrived late to a CR and lost almost 3 minutes beofre starting! But he was a very humble and funny guy and he's one of the commentators of cyclism here in Spain and he's the best I've ever heard. You can spend 4 hours without nothing happening in the race and he makes it fun and interesting.

    I used to take a nap when young with the buzzing sound of the helicopter and I would always wake up 10 kms to the end of the race. Great great moments of my life.

    I couldn't see Merckx life unfortunately, but I've watched great moments: Lemond beating Fignon (who would spit the cameraman) at Paris, the triumph of Delgado, the great tours of the big Indurain (he was taller than Andy Schleck and a beast at CR), climbing Alpe d'Huez with his 90 kgs... I've also witnessed Roche, Millar, Zulle, the poor "always second" Rominger, Pantani, the brutal accident of Abdoujaparov at Paris, Beloki shattering his future on that damn curve, the great Riis, Berzin, Bugno, Chiapucci, Cipollini, the king Lance Armstrong... and many many many more.

    I had a great moment now remembering things. We bought a 50" TV for our office just to watch the Tour at summer. We work all the afternoon watching them.

    About Contador and Schleck, it's been one of the most even races of all times. Both deserved to win. Both are great climbers and are miles ahead of the rest. It consitutes a great fight and big moments of cycling await us in the next editions.

    About the incident, I think it was a little unfair, but it was also unfair to stop the race when Andy was loosing 4 minutes because of a fall. The next day Contador was cut by a fall and lost almost 1 minute, and I can't see anyone saying anything about it.

    If it had been a fall due to a spectator, I think Contador would stop, just as Armstrong did in one of his tours. But the mechanical problem was clearly a fault of Andy himself. All in all, you can say it was unfair, but then you would also have to say that it was unfair to selectively stop the race when andy was loosing 4 minutes and not doing it when Contador lost 1.

    The best option is always go forward, never stop. Only if an "exterior" element causes a fall. Be it a spectator or a dog (did you see the sheeps that almost set a fall this year?).

    Great to see there are more cycling lovers around here. Unfortunately one of them is a Madrid fan, but... well, maybe with age you can cure that! Just joking, specialone, you know I appreciate you so much and we always have great and constructive talks.
     
  12. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Saturday the Classica San Sebastian (Donosti?)...i have a feeling that Barredo could win this for the second consecutive time. He was very strong in the last Pyrenees stages...but he will have to beat "our" Philip Gilbert.

    I'm also looking forward to the Vuelta. As a matter of fact i always prefer Vuelta and (certainly) the Giro to the much more popular Tour de France. Both Vuelta and Giro can be pretty unpredictable...i like that.

    I still cycle pretty much (50 to 80 km a day), but when i was younger i was a real freak. I cycled form Rome to Beijing in 1993-1994. And round the same period i climbed some famous mountains in Italy (Gavia, Mortirolo, Tonnale) and France (Galibier, Croix de Fer, Col de la Bonnette). Now i've much more weight and i'm don't cycle in the mountains anymore.
     
  13. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    I never cycled that much, only occasionally. Is the Mortirolo as brutal as they say? Which is the mountain youf found to be tha hardest?
     
  14. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    The hardest climb i've done that cyclists also do is the Gavia and the Mortirolo. The Mortirolo because he's steep, the Gavia because he's high, long and steep.
    The hardest climb i've done was when cycling to Beijing: the Khunjerab pass on the fronteer between Pakistan and China. This is part of the Karakorum highway and this pass has an altitude of 4780 metres. To reach the summit of that pass was one of the biggest rewards i've had in my life. Descending into China is a fantastic feeling.
     
  15. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    :EMB:Jesus, that sounds the adventure of a life. Great to hear you've exprienced something like this. Grand! Probably cycling at 4780 is almost a torture and wouldn't be healthy to do competitions there, but my imagination already plays with Pantani and the likes battling for that peak.

    I haven't even climbed to anything above 1.000 meters myself... :EMB:

    But that's because I need a footy ball in front. If they put me a ball in my feet I can run all my life. Without it, I get tired quickly. That's why I've never managed to cycle regularly. I need to score goals by the way!
     
  16. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Every type of cycling above 1800 metres is problematic for some people, even for professional cyclists. That is the reason why the great Vinokourov will never win a big tour. He's good until 1800 metres, higher he has problems.
    When i climbed that high, i was cycling from Rome, so at the time i was a very experienced cyclist (although not a fast one!). I had also climbed in nearby mountains and in moutains in Iran (a beautifull country by the way). We had done some other Karakorum passes of around 2000 metres and 3000 metres, this in order to get used to the altitude.
    It took us nearly a day to reach the summit of the pass.
     
  17. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Oh God! Gerd, you should have been a professional cycling. The manner you talk about cycling and those experiences you told really show your tremendous passion for this beautiful sport. :APPLAUD:
    I loved the history about Merckx and I glad to see he his a gentleman and a very nice guy. Marco Chagas (former cyclist and RTP commentator) says Merckx is the best cyclist ever.

    Drekkard, I frankly hope we can meet some day. It's really nice to talk with you about football, cycling, basketball, whatever. Unfortunately you have a bad football taste but what can I do? :LOL: No problem in here, one of my best friends is a Sporting fan. I would like to do an Erasmus in Madrid or Barcelona maybe this time.

    Did you see the news about Contador? He won't renew with Astana and sources are saying he is on the way to Saxo Bank. Personally I believe he would fit better in Caisse d'Epargne (well, probably not Caisse d'Epargne but a new sponsor) under Unzue command. Valverde is out, they need a leader and the team is quite good with the like of Luis Leon Sanchez, Cobo and David Arroyo. Plus, Contador will take the heritage of Indurain and Delgado.

    Sugestion: we should rename this forum to Cycling Thread. I think we will have many things to discuss about cycling all over the year. :))
     
  18. lo zio

    lo zio International

    24 October 2005
    Palermo
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    and here i thought gerd and me were the only ciclysm fans in here! great to see 2 of the very nicests guys in this forum (drekkard and the special one) share our passion for cyclism. :))

    Gerd, we already talked several times about your epic challenge at the mortirolo and about your trip along the way of silk......... but Jesus Christ, u never told me u also climbed the galibier!!!! and croix de fer!!!! :SHOCK::SHOCK::SHOCK:
    u do realise u faced the 2 most legendary challenges in cyclism (mortirolo and galibier), do u? WOW!!! just WOW!!! :WORSHIP::WORSHIP::WORSHIP:

    u know last summer i was watching a "tappa" of the giro with some friends at home and i told em "a friend of mind climbed the stelvio, the tonale and the mortirolo". so they turned to my girl and asked her who was this guy and she replied "i don't know. only thing i know is that his name is Gerd, he's belgian and he's one of ben's heroes".
    and one of my friends replied "and i can see why. hell he climbed the mortirolo.... this guy just became my hero too and i don't even know him!"
     
  19. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    The guy climbed the Mortirolo and those other mountians a long time ago. That guy is now struggling to keep his weight under 90 kilo's.
    He still cycles a lot, but only on flat roads. That guy is an has been or rather a never will be... I climbed those passes with a "triple" on my bike. Everybody can do that with a litle bit of patience. The only regret i have is that i never climbed in the Pyrenees. In this year's Tour there were two absolutely splendid but less known climbs (one is the Pailhères, the other was the climb where "chaingaste" happened).

    Special one: if i would say to my friends that an internet friend thinks i'm as good as professional cyclists, they would laugh a lot. Belgian is to cyclism what Brazil is to football: everybody has a passion for it. This year alone i know maybe 20 people who climbed the Ventoux in a massa event in june (exclusively for Belgians). Oh and by the way i also climbed the Ventoux, a beast. But once you descend, then you come in the town of Saux where you can find the most beautifull "café" in the world...there you have a view on the Ventoux and the lavender fields.

    About Contador: today there is an article in the paper about Riis who denies that Contador will ride for Saxobank.
    In the same paper there is talk of a rumour in theSpanish press that Fernando Alonso (Formula One pilot and friend of Contador and Valverde) would start a new team with the Spoanish Astana riders and the Caisse D' Epargne team.

    Ben give my regards to your girlfriend.
     
  20. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Yes I heard about that rumor with Fernando Alonso. It almost happened last year and everyone knew Contador was not very happy with Astana (mainly to what happened with Armstrong last year).

    You climbed also Ventoux? Jesus you're my hero too. :OOOH:

    About known mountains, I only climbed the Ordino-Arcalís route that they did last year in the Tour. But I did it 20 years ago (I'm a bit old) and found it extremely hard! I was a wild one at that age, and had to stop in the middle of the ascension to fix something (I don't remember what right now). I was with a friend and then we went on to the end. We spend some hours, actually, and we did only about 40 kms (to me it seemed like 400!). I was wearing a "Reynolds" maillot (I was a fan of Pedro Delgado, remember).

    So, I value your story a lot, and though I've never seen your face, I can imagine it with a kind of white glow around it.
    :WORSHIP:

    Could you make a single post with all the "mythic" summits you've conquered that cyclists also do in the big 3? And have them in order of "favorites". Not only difficulty, but the views, the "feeling", etc... If it's not too much to ask.
     
  21. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
  22. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Like i said, this was almost 20 years ago. Although i stil cycle a lot, no more cols for me.

    Summits:

    1 Gavia: to me the most mythic
    2 Mortirolo: the steepest
    3 Stelvio: reaching the summit and seeing that winding road with all these hairpins.
    4 Croix de Fer: the view (although i enjoyed it more a day afterwards in a car)
    5 Galibier + Lautaret (Lautaret is a part of the Galibier)
    6 Ventoux: steep and the fantastic town of Saux
    7 Tonale: the least of all these passes but it was my first, the one that gave me confidence to do the others.

    But now, lets stop talking about me and dedicate this thread to real cycling. Today is the day of the Classica San Sebastian. The first edition with two climbs of the Jaizikibel. I wonder ho will win. In Belgium we hope for Gilbert (Omega Pharma is my favourite team) but i also hope for Kreuziger (one of my favourite bikers).

    One thing about the Tour de France. In this year's Tour a cyclist of my village (Duffel) made his debut: Kevin De Weert. He finished 18th in the general classification. This is pretty good for a guy who started the Tour as a "domestique" and spend lots of energy in helping Chavanel and Pineau.

    PS: drekkard, i don't know if you like music, but there is a pretty good Scottish band called the Delgado's. They made some great records (think they disbanded in 2005).
     
  23. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Thnks for the list and the info. About De Weert, it's great he finished 18th in his first big race, it's very hard to achieve something like this.

    Kreuziger was good also in the Tour, almost always in the first group of the race, and fighting to recover when he was getting behind. He's very young so there's still a lot of evolution left. I hope someone elese joins the Contador-Schleck battle. The more favorites, the better the spectacle. That's why the "Classicas" are so good, anyone can win given the day. It's like Cup competitions, where there's always a big margin for surprises.

    I'm going to see what the Delgado's were up to, thx!
     
  24. The_Special_One

    The_Special_One I like Unicorns

    17 August 2007
    Cascais
    Estoril | Knicks
    Last edited: 30 September 2010
  25. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    I'm very sceptical about Contador's story. It's always contaminated food.
    I read this news on the site of Belgian paper "DE MORGEN" and they interviewed a specialist doctor.
    He claims clenbuterol is used to "camouflage" the use of EPO. This is a case which seems similar with what happened with Pedro Delgado in 1987 when he won the Tour. He was positive for a product that was hiding more serious drugs.

    In all likelyhood Contador will get away with it...but i don't believe him. The most controlled cyclist eats contaminated food...come on...
     
  26. we7god

    we7god Kreisklassen-Profi

    15 August 2003
    Germany - Soester Börde
    FC Schalke 04
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    of course it was contaminated food - that's what happens all day worldwide... :EMB:

    absolutely nonsense - who still believes that the "top"-cyclists don't do doping???

    there was a time i was fascinated by this sport, but since some years i don't give a fuck about those cheaters. they lost a lot of credibility and respect. i only feel sorry for the poor guys which are actually not using the help of EPO etc, but try to be fair sportsmen...
     
  27. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    That's a bit of a one-sided view.
    Do you think that doping is only used by cyclists and not by other sportsmen and women?
    Look at Juventus.
    Look at opertion Puerto (or was it Puerta?) in Spain. Among the lists of clients of that doctor there were also football players...
    It's an issue in cycling because there are much more controls in cycling than in any other sport.

    I agree with you that those people are cheaters, but i think there are far less cheaters in cycling that 10 years ago.
     
  28. drekkard

    drekkard International

    23 March 2005
    Barcelona
    Barça, Arsenal, Ajax
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Not trying to defend him at all, but according to what I read, it was only a 0,0005 mg above the standard levels, so it may have been something else, because it doesn't make sense to have this levels only a day in a 21 days tour, isn't it?

    On the other hand, it's possible he had the clembuterol entering his body because he did a blood transfussion. His own blood from another month in whic he indeed had clembuterol in his veins...

    I really think all the top cyclists dope themselves in a way or another, but it's sad when they find out. All the winners of the last 20 editions have been linked to doping. So do most of the "favorites". Due to the pressure of media, there's less doping now than 10 years ago, surely, but not at top levels. Let's see what happens.
     
  29. we7god

    we7god Kreisklassen-Profi

    15 August 2003
    Germany - Soester Börde
    FC Schalke 04
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    of course i don't believe that doping is just an issue in cycling.
    i think doping is a problem in many sports.
    in germany the latest case of doping was Dimitrij Ovtcharov (player of our national table tennis squad that won the european team championship)... :-(
    he also claims that contaminated food was the cause of that values... seems to be the top apology these days... :D

    but in cycling it's abolutely weird. it seems that everybody knows about it and especially around the tour de france it's insane how many winners and top cyclists are found guilty...
    maybe there are less cheaters than some years before or maybe the techniques today are more efficient?!?!
    i agree with drekkard - i don't belive that there is less doping at top level...

    the bad thing is that those "actors" are going to ruin the sport. and on the otherside they don't know the effects on their bodies for the next decades...
    as you mentioned some of them died due to a heartattack or something like this... really a sad topic...
     
    Last edited: 30 September 2010
  30. gerd

    gerd Retired Footballer

    8 January 2002
    Over the moon
    KRC Genk, Spurs
    Re: TOUR DE FRANCE 2010

    Well, it's very bad day for cycling. I have an electronic news letter about cycling.
    I just read that Ezequiel Mosquera (the second in the Vuelta) was also found positive (don't know what substance was found however).
    And there are indications that Ricardo Ricco is also involved in some sort of doping connection. Italian justice is examining this.

    I've always had doubts about both Mosquera and Ricco. But i'm not so sure about Contador. A Dutch scientist has come to the defense of Contador. Drekkard said that Contador had only a tiny litle bit of clenbuterol above the limit. If you know that the limit is 0, than this is absurd. The Dutch scientist is sure that the clenbuterol was coming from food. In certain countries clenbuterol is used in meat production. Further on he says that this tiny amount has no influence whatsoever on the performance of cyclists...so this could be much ado about nothing.

    I too was disgusted about the cheating (and the biggest cheater of all was never caught: Armstrong) but i'm a litle bit moreoptimistic that there is currently less doping than in the Armstrong-Ullrich -Pantani era.

    If you look at the chrono's cyclists have on the big climbs, you see that they are considerably slower now than in that period. The difference must come from somewhere...
     

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