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Red Cards - Should They Be Replaced?

Discussion in 'Football' started by proxi, 27 August 2005.

  1. proxi

    proxi Champions League

    9 February 2003
    Sheffield
    Tottenham Hotspur
    Listening to the BBC's Final Score earlier, Ray Stubbs of all people came out with the idea for a new meaning of red cards. It wasn't an entirely new idea but it brought it up really clear in my eyes, especially seeing what a red card had done to Spurs today against Chelsea.

    He said "get rid of red cards meaning send a player off and thats it". And instead, use "forced substitutions". This meaning a player gets a red card and has to be substituted.

    Why do i bring this up, may you ask?

    Well - i certainly am one person who believes the game should be about 11 Vs 11, two full teams playing football and finding the winner. Surely it's a test of a club's squad if their star striker or prize anchorman is sent off and has to be replaced by a "lesser player"? Football is entertainment and people spend hundreds sometimes in a month, thousands each season to watch the beautiful game. Do you get annoyed when a player on your team gets sent off, especially early on? Or when a player on the oppsoite side gets sent off and they shut up shop? Meaning you'll not know who was the better "eleven-playered team" after all?

    I'm being open here, and trying not to "brain-wash" too much, hopefully not at all.

    I'd prefer them to force substitutions, and give out the bans after as normal.
     
  2. Proddy12

    Proddy12 Guest

    no they should not be replaced
     
  3. proxi

    proxi Champions League

    9 February 2003
    Sheffield
    Tottenham Hotspur
    Thanks, it was the in-depth reasons that swayed me.

    I love red cards, why on earth should we change them..

    ;)
     
  4. Proddy12

    Proddy12 Guest

    no problems
    so you dont think it would be unfair on say a team like Bolton to lose a man, compared to Chelsea losing a man, the quality of players on the subs bench would mean the forced sub affects the lesser teams more than the bigger teams, which would not be fair at all, red cards are there for a reason and the punishement normally deserves the crime.

    imagine your striker is clean through, the defender knows hey it wont cost my team to chop him down and save a goal, down he goes bring on a sub, free kick goes into row z and your team goes on to lose 1-0, would that make you happy?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 27 August 2005
  5. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    What about an Orange Card representing the idea above?
    It could be given for 2 yellow cards and the old red cards can only be given straight away.
     
  6. proxi

    proxi Champions League

    9 February 2003
    Sheffield
    Tottenham Hotspur
    See your points this time Proddy :)

    But then looking on the other hand - if we say that this method would be unfair because it shows up the strength of the subs bench for each team, doesn't a player actually fitting into a team "on the day" count for anything. I know that on first hand it'll feel harsh but players from all squads from whatever price range come onto the field and do shit-all sometimes.

    Managers play their best eleven normally. So normally they would see a lesser player have to come on, someone they didn't plan on using at that time. Whether it's Chelsea, Bolton or even Arsenal :D It has it's good points and it's bad points but for me it's better than seeing a game be completely changed due to a team having to change their style because of one player's bad play or lack of luck with the referees decision.

    I'm all for entertainment, and although i have seen some corking games with sides who have been one or two men down and play excellently - the idea of having the red card system changed.. interests me! :D
     
  7. 200_pesos

    200_pesos Guille, no te olvidare!!!

    1 July 2005
    New York, NY
    Boca Juniors, Legia
    I agree with RuneEdge, the idea of an orange card for two yellows actually sounds very good.
     
  8. JayM

    JayM International

    17 April 2004
    North Yorkshire
    Celtic
    Don't think it would work...

    Lets say Chelsea are wanting to bring on SWP for Duff, Duff gets annoyed and boots someone in the head, red card, SWP comes on...

    Doesn't quite work. :p
     
  9. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    But my idea would give you the best of both ideas. Have red cards for sending you off but have a orange card, which is only given for 2 yellows, for a forced substitution.
     
  10. Milanista

    Milanista Mangiamoli! Staff

    19 December 2002
    London & Milan
    AC Milan
    Id say keep it the way it is. A red card only has 1 person to blame, and that person will affect his whole team. So that forces the team to play differently, and stop him from doing it in the future.

    By forcing a substitution, what if a player does it on purpose to get off the field? Theres no penalising or punishment for those doing terrible tackles or touching the ball on purpose by hand.
     
  11. martinja

    martinja Guest

    That would make the red card nearly pointless, as anyone could do a harshtackle, on the last man from behind just infront of the penalty just to be replaced : )
     
  12. Milanista

    Milanista Mangiamoli! Staff

    19 December 2002
    London & Milan
    AC Milan
    But would get a suspension after.
     
  13. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    Doesnt anyone get my idea yet?
    The way it would work is that if someone does a very bad tackle, whether or not on purpose, and the ref decides he needs to go off, he'll give them the red card.
    But if someone picks up two yellows, the ref can give them an ORANGE card and then force the player to be subbed.
    So if the system is being exploited, just give them the red and send them off. If a player gets two yellows and its too harsh to send them off, you give them a orange and them get them subbed.
     
  14. kingpug

    kingpug Guest

    I think red cars happen too much these days, wether that is the idiot refs or the players, it shouldn't happen as much as it does.

    I would rather see a red cards meaning the player gets sent off for about 15 minutes then comes back. I mean we don't know what it is like playing against a team like Chelsea with 50k people watching, all it takes is a lack of judgement and a heap of adrenaline and you do something you wouldn't normally do.

    I think it is silly really, a straight red for a bad challenge isn't a good idea, because a red totally destroys the game, and we want to see a football match not one team defend while the other pumps everyone forward due to the one man advantage.
     
  15. red card = punishment

    its up to you not to get punished and leave your team mates .. if its a game of 11 v 11 then play by rules.
     
  16. kingpug

    kingpug Guest

    Keep in mind these people are human, they can't make sure every tackle is perfect, I mean you could side in and the player knocks the ball away meaning you hit his legs and make it look bad when it ain't.

    I just think FIFA should have a video ref like they do in rugby, for example the shit with Jenas, it was a bit late tot ake away his red card after the damage had been done, yet with a video ref they could have seen the challenge wasn't bad and gave him a yellow instead on the day, who knows what the score could have been.

    Or if they don't do this, which they won't, add 2 extra linesmen, sso you have 2 on each side which is better, I mean how can you expect one guy to see what happens on 1 side of the pitch?

    Half of the linesmen and ref are blind, so if you don't add any of the above 2 options they need to re-take the test because half of the refs I see are fucking retarded and shame the sport.
     
  17. martinja

    martinja Guest

    Heavens forbid that these players are held liable for their actions and get punished.
     
  18. Sulph

    Sulph Goodbye...

    28 September 2003
    I dont like when ppl try to change teh game!
     
  19. gungrave

    gungrave Conference

    7 August 2003
    PORTUGAL
    instead of a red card the referee could use a tazer-gun or something...that should be more entertaining.

    changing the red card it's completly impossible...it's unfair playing eleven vs ten nine or even eight, but thats all the point!
     
  20. Gorskino10

    Gorskino10 Guest

    lets go with the budwisher advert and do added time multi-ball while we are changing the cards the rules like red card has been going for years and years so whats the point
     
  21. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    Why is everyone avoiding my idea? Whats wrong with it?
     
  22. proxi

    proxi Champions League

    9 February 2003
    Sheffield
    Tottenham Hotspur
    I don't see anything wrong with it dude. I'm not afraid of change :)

    It's a better evolution of the one i started with anyway! Some things are meant to be in football - but adding an Orange card and keeping more of a chance to keep the game entertaining... i'm for it. Still punish the players with Red cards and give them bans etc, but leave that chance open for Orange cards, all the debatable Reds go to Orange.
     
  23. Mack

    Mack Champions League

    8 August 2003
    Manchester
    MCFC
    Theres a minor bug to be considered what happens if the players team given the "Orange card" has no subs left?
     
  24. Sulph

    Sulph Goodbye...

    28 September 2003
    Its stupid because the team should be at fault for not being to control their players, so they should lose a men, not just have him replaced.
     
  25. rockykabir

    rockykabir hello

    30 March 2003
    London -> New York -> San Francisco
    Liverpool FC
    Teams/Players should be punished for their vicious tactics. Getting the decision wrong has nothing to do with the debate of the red card factor.

    I think its more of a case of beating around the bush and not tackling the real problem in the decision making (which can resolved by technology....possibly).
     
  26. Nickybaker

    Nickybaker You want SEVEN?

    15 October 2003
    Essex
    The one and only Arsenal
    ie BLACKBURN!!!!!!
     
  27. *aLe

    *aLe International

    30 August 2005
    On the hype train
    Cunturipa!
    I think they should try not to use orange cards instead of reds, but they can just use them as a halfway between a booking and a red card.. I'm not afraid to try new things in order to make the gameplay better.. but imho it just won't work..

    Milanista, maybe you remember when they tried to send on the field two referees instad of one in the TIM cup matches, a couple of years ago.. well, I think that the idea of replacing red cards is going to follow the same course, it will be discarded after a few weeks..
     
  28. Sulph

    Sulph Goodbye...

    28 September 2003
    The whole orange card thing is ridiculous.
     
  29. RuneEdge

    RuneEdge Silent Assassin

    1 October 2003
    Turn around, I'm right behind you...
    Manchester United
    ARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

    Thats exactly what I'm saying. Doesnt ayone get it yet?

    If someone fouls another player but its not too serious, its a yellow card.
    If someone does a bad tackle, its a red card and a sending off.
    If someone picks up two yellow cards, they are given a orange card instead of a red which means a forced substitution.
     
  30. Sulph

    Sulph Goodbye...

    28 September 2003
    But my point is the team sould suffer because they cant control their players, they shouldnt be allowed to just bring on a nother player!

    Its the managers fault!
     

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