eFootball PES 2020 News Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Pro Evolution Soccer' started by ThomasGOAL, 7 June 2019.

  1. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    Kinda like with GT. polyphony digital is creating content that needs more power under the hood (GT is PS5 ready). So if it works for GT, it’s a possibility it could happen here, IMO.
    And i like that thought! :)
     
    Elanimator likes this.
  2. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    question: have we ever had that many teams (14) in a demo?
     
    wijnar1 and Chris Davies like this.
  3. grumpypesfan

    grumpypesfan Non-League

    10 July 2019
    exactly this. so many similar issues to the last few years, especially 2019, like robotic animations, sliding/ice skating before shots, clipping, sub-par ai and more.

    no chance. sure, the new engine (most likely unreal) will probably come with 2021, but no way they're using the new engine for these screenshots or anything else. this is still the fox engine, just touched up a lot with other tools.

    also, you give konami too much credit (tongue in cheek comment, no disrespect to you). they don't have the foresight or planning ability to have done any work on the new engine yet. i hope i'm wrong, but if recent history tells us anything it's that an engine change and jump up to new consoles is always a disaster when it comes to pes. 2021 and the move to ps5/scarlett will be make or break for pes.
     
    Colon and Elanimator like this.
  4. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    They broke it when moving to ps4 and PES is still here. ;)
    I can think of them working on stuff that can be implemented in the new engine.
    Can’t get that GT comparison out of my head.
     
  5. grumpypesfan

    grumpypesfan Non-League

    10 July 2019
    it broke when they moved to ps3/xbox 360 with what still was a ps2 coded game. like building a skyscraper on hugely shaky foundations, especially with net/online coding. they've continued to do that too. while on ps4 it's fox engine running things, there's still ps2/ps3 code there and it can be seen.

    you're right. pes still here. survived the ps3/xbox 360 era because of fans clinging onto hope and while sales declined they were okay enough to keep things going. its the hardcore and fans clinging onto hope that kept it going. in the ps4/xbox one era it has stayed alive plainly and simply because of myclub (only just too). if it was just down to boxed and digital sales (even though latter is on rise), pes would be dead or free to play game only.

    fox engine is a different beast to unreal, so while some code and other minor things can be "moved over" the transition is a much bigger job than you or most people think. it's almost like starting from scratch. the gt comparison doesn't work as the firstly the series creator is much more forward thinking than konami ever will be and with him it's the case of the console is not ready for his engine/game lol. plus, as a first party playstation game, you bet your ass gt will be ready for ps5. they would have been working on it for a while now.

    so, yeah, i stick by my opinion. if the transition to ps5/scarlett and new engine goes badly, pes could be in trouble in regards to a series as we know it.
     
  6. Lons

    Lons AMIGA 1200 HARDCORE FAN!

    @Chuny Look at these quality of stadia. Forget about new engine in 2021. They still will use FOX. I'm 100% sure of that.
     
    Last edited: 12 July 2019
  7. elloco

    elloco League 1

    19 November 2013
    look at these outdated animations, look at these poor physics, look at these static keeper animations, look at the time of updates, look at the time of fixing major bugs, look at this poor AI...

    with NextGen they had to change something fundamentally !!! I'm 100% sure of that.
     
    M2015 and tosser like this.
  8. gabe.paul.logan

    gabe.paul.logan Golden Boot Winner

    7 January 2007
    Budapest
    Hungary
    God hope not i dont want another pes2008 or 2014 and 2+ years of fixing and learning the new engine.
     
  9. espimas

    espimas Conference

    5 July 2017
    Best way to see if there is variety in AI gameplay styles, or if it's all the same
     
    incas36, talucchesi, peterc10 and 2 others like this.
  10. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    i'm so proud at myself and some of the fellow lads here (for this year especially) that we keep kinda quit somehow! we need to play, not talk before release! :TU:
     
    Last edited: 12 July 2019
    Lami and wijnar1 like this.
  11. Lons

    Lons AMIGA 1200 HARDCORE FAN!

    Agree but look for ball physics for example. Animations are poor but we don't know it's from engine restrictions or poor Konami developers.Don't forget that KONAMI devs has problem to create nice looking menus or realistic banners. Its engine problem? Nah
     
  12. elloco

    elloco League 1

    19 November 2013
    Fox Engine is in house developed... the 2 Mainbrains behind the Foxengine had left Konami!

    we dont know how many people actually working on FOXengine, Problem here they just dont have enough know how and manpower with this engine, its not open source so they cant simple hire new FOXengine pros...

    what did we know about that Engine ? How safe is it for the future ? raytracing, physics, AI...

    there are many questions that UNREALengine can answer...
     
    peterc10 likes this.
  13. Nacho10

    Nacho10 Conference

    8 August 2018
    So many teams to 'give away' in a demo... I have a horrible feeling it will be 5 minute games again!
     
  14. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    you can relax now, @Nacho10 ! up to 10 minutes is confirmed! :TU:
     
  15. Paynekiller

    Paynekiller League 1

    14 June 2015
    Online matches in the demo will not be restricted to 5 mins but offline matches almost certainly will.

    Has this been confirmed for demo offline matches?
     

  16. PS4? Who said anything about PS4?
    If 2021 comes with a new engine, it will be for the new generation of consoles.

    You know...
    Before PES 2018 came out, or somewhere around that, Konami/PES were looking for new staff. I remember it clearly.
    They were looking for artists, designers, etc.. And I think it was Kei Masuda who said that a new engine would only come when the nextgen consoles are out and the current gen will still be tied to the FOX ENGINE, that's not gonna change.

    So you can see my scepticism.
    I don't think every new big move from generation to generation has to be a pain in the ass. It doesn't. We shouldn't be worrying over another PES 2014 debacle. It doesn't have to be like that.
    And I don't know how much of a workload it could be for Konami to take what they have now to UE.
    Don't forget PES for mobile is already developed with UE so they already have some expertise developing for that engine.
     
  17. Elanimator

    Elanimator League 1

    5 November 2017
    Hi @Chuny.

    That's a response to @VuZet's post: "I don't know why KONAMI showing it if it's not taken from the game."
    which I assume he meant the CURRENT(pes2020) "game", and not the Ps5 game.
     
    Chuny likes this.
  18. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    you could see in videos they are setting up the time from 5-10 minutes! they did play offline at these events! so i'm pretty sure it was in.
     
  19. Cro_Cop

    Cro_Cop Non-League

    4 October 2018
    Yes, It will be a good chance to see how the AI play and most of all the Player ID of the big players. We've seen a bit of dribbling in past gameplay videos,hope this version is even more improved..dont think they would give us a build with a AI that they're not confident with..
     
  20. Elanimator

    Elanimator League 1

    5 November 2017
    I'm leaning more towards poor developers than engine restriction. They're not competent with other aspects of the game that is not engine related, so there's no reason to believe that they are competent with other aspects of the game that involves the game engine.
    -------------

    Just a theory on why the issues from years ago are not being fixed.

    I think the main issue is how they program the game.
    Of course, they have a "base program"(code or whatever you call it) for this game.
    They just "tweak or add things" to improve it each year.

    What if there are issues that can't be fixed just by "tweaking or adding things", and require re-building/re-writing "base program"?

    They have 2 options:
    1.) Ignore or not fix the issues, and just try to MASK it with other things that they can "tweak or add" easily.
    2.) Re-writing the "base program" which requires a lot of work but will fix the core issues.

    It's obvious that they're doing option 1 each year because that's the more practical for them.
    Option 2 is great and the only way I think the core issues we have from years ago will get fixed.

    A NEW ENGINE will give us hope that they'll do Option 2 because they almost have NO CHOICE but to re-write a new program for that new engine.
     
    Last edited: 12 July 2019
    incas36 and Emroth like this.
  21. Paynekiller

    Paynekiller League 1

    14 June 2015
    Last year at GamesCom they showed 10 minute offline matches against the Ai but the public demo and the lite version were limited to 5 minute offline matches.
     
    Last edited: 12 July 2019
  22. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    ok! then, lets see! i'm relaxed! :D
     
    Elanimator likes this.
  23. Elanimator

    Elanimator League 1

    5 November 2017
    I don't care it they make it a 1 minute match against the AI but for the sake of console people, I hope they make it 10 minutes.
     
    PRO_TOO likes this.
  24. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    yeah, me too!!
    the second demo, releasing sep. 10th, will feature more minutes per match! the final game, released around spring 2020 (via updates) will feature the same as the second demo! ;)
     
    Elanimator likes this.
  25. amartingil

    amartingil League 2

    20 September 2016
    Poor animations? In comparison to? to Fifa? to a CGI?

    It's too easy use ragdoll system like fifa does. But you like its weird animations?

    It's too easy take all stuff from motion capture and make a CGI, or a animation system like PES 2014, without any differences between players, with a rigid control and freedomless.

    I'm agree about the engine. About devs, I think the point is Konami hasn't enought resources to do everything we want. And Konami puts huge focus on aesthetics, bzc if the game has a big visual impact, it will generate more sales.
     
    incas36 likes this.
  26. tommyk1985

    tommyk1985 Non-League

    19 November 2014
    England
    Nottingham Forest
    Nailed it.
     
  27. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    is the following clip new gameplay or just reuploaded footage we already know!? i'm not sure.
     
  28. aussiepesfan

    aussiepesfan Premiership

    17 April 2002
     
    ThomasGOAL and Loopy like this.
  29. Chris Davies

    Chris Davies Chief PESsimist Staff

    14 May 2003
    Tranmere Rovers
    Watching that makes me think we need a new button, defensively... "Pressure the nearest man", i.e. not just "pressure the ball-carrier".

    I say that because there's a little moment at the start of the clip that I often struggle with, where (in all PES games) you...

    A) Have to select the right defender (which may take a few attempts)

    B) "Wake them up" (i.e. start moving them in the right direction, but turning animations take so long that it can take a second or two just to get them facing the right way), and finally

    C) Try to follow the path of the guy you want to mark, without just running straight past him because your directional input is slightly off, wobbling left/right (in real life, you clearly see the guy and you can run straight towards him without ever "missing" and going the wrong way - after all, that's why the pressure button already acts as a lock-on system, so that you don't just speed past the attacker)

    Here's the time-stamp (57 seconds):

     
  30. PRO_TOO

    PRO_TOO Team Heffernan

    25 May 2003
    Rego Park, Germany
    Team Heffernan
    i get your point, and again, a slower "in between animation" is needed for small steps!
    in that situation i say: the user is heavy involved in that chaos. he's constantly switching players and as a result "pulling the player out of their AI movements" (wich is to hectic)! this brings me back to point 1. we need a small steps animation in between to stop this hectic "start'n'stop" motion!
    its a mix of both here, imo.
     
    Last edited: 12 July 2019
    Sovereign Hope likes this.

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